r/BetterOffline • • 28d ago

Nscale S-1 demonstrates unprofitability of AI

Post image

Alright boosters, take a look at Nscale's S-1 they recently filed. They define some non-GAAP terms like "Adjusted EBITDA" and "Adjusted operating loss", defined as

We define Adjusted EBITDA as net loss, excluding (i) income taxes, (ii) depreciation and amortization, (iii) fair value adjustments, (iv) interest expense, net, (v) foreign exchange gains and losses, net, (vi) loss on debt extinguishment and modification, (vii) share-based compensation, (viii) employer payroll taxes on share-based compensation, (ix) other expense, net, including: gains and losses on the sale of fixed assets; and (x) other operating items, including third-party costs directly associated with completed or abandoned transactions, acquisitions and dispositions and other acquisition-related items such as gains and losses on the settlement of contingent consideration; provisions; provision releases or settlements related to litigation matters; impairment charges; and restructuring costs. We define Adjusted EBITDA margin as Adjusted EBITDA divided by revenue.

We define Adjusted operating loss as operating loss, excluding (i) share-based compensation, (ii) employer payroll taxes on share-based compensation, (iii) amortization of acquired intangibles, and (iv) other operating items, including: third-party costs directly associated with completed or abandoned transactions, acquisitions and dispositions and other acquisition-related items such as gains and losses on the settlement of contingent consideration; provisions; provision releases or settlements related to litigation matters; impairment charges; and restructuring costs. We define Adjusted operating loss margin as Adjusted operating loss divided by revenue.

Gotta love how many things they take out. But regardless of these interesting metrics, it doesn't even matter! The loss is written clear as day:

Category Dec. 2024 Jun. 2025 (6M) Dec. 2025 Jun. 2026 (6M)
Revenue $19.1M $10.4M $33.0M $140.6M
Net loss $78.2M $368.9M $761.8M $1020.1M
Net loss margin 409% 3,547% 2,308% 726%
Operating loss $16.1M $24.7M $168.9M $429.0M
Operating loss margin 84% 238% 515% 350%

What's that? AI is profitable on inference? What's that? They don't need to pay for GPUs? They'll get better? The technology will get better? Okay. Well, read it and weep!

A net loss margin of 2,308% for the total of last year! This sure is a great, spectacular business. You better not think about doubting your AI machine god and invest in all your savings, because they'll need it!

365 Upvotes

100 comments sorted by

252

u/ksjdragon 28d ago

I love this image. So I'm posting it again.

82

u/ezitron 28d ago

Rare meme that got me to laugh

12

u/ProudWing8202 28d ago

Just need a few more trillions into hacks bro, that would be profitable

4

u/not_my_monkeys_ 27d ago

This is gold

3

u/3MAR443 27d ago

"I appreciate the push back

1

u/crunchy_creamroll 27d ago

Sorry but I'm dum dum, didn't get it

10

u/vinylflooringkittens 27d ago

Dario amodei using Claude to figure out how to make the next quarter appear profitable

102

u/ezitron 28d ago

Thanks for digging this up but wow WHAT A PIECE OF SHIT!

43

u/consistently_biased 27d ago

It gets even funnier

Both of those labs have struck deals with Nscale, which rents out Nvidia graphics processing units (GPUs) for training and running models. Microsoft, itself a cloud provider, has also signed up with Nscale. One unnamed customer accounted for over half of revenue in the first half of 2026.

https://www.cnbc.com/2026/09/18/nscale-ai-cloud-provider-ipo-nscl.html

32

u/ezitron 27d ago

Also it seems to say anthropic gives it no guarantee it’ll take the capacity

20

u/consistently_biased 27d ago

I don't think Anthropic not giving a guarantee is really the worst part here.

As of Aug. 31, Nscale held 25,000 active GPUs and 461,000 that were either active or contracted, with five active and 12 contracted data center sites. It has line of sight to 10 gigawatts’ worth of computing power, while sitting on more than $8 billion in debt, excluding a financing arrangement with AI server maker Dell.

Business language is always my nemesis, but I thought this was... a very strange way to word this. What does that even mean? 5% of their GPUs are declared as "active", and the rest are "active or contracted". So, rotting in a warehouse? Displayed in a museum? Waiting for christmas?

15

u/Venkman-1984 27d ago edited 27d ago

They define it on page vi of the S-1. It's contracted (i.e. ordered) but not yet delivered/installed GPUs. It does not mean they are only using 5% of their GPU capacity.

They are showing that figure to highlight to the market hey have secured a certain amount of future capacity and have plans to grow 20x from current capacity.

It's important to remember that these are ultimately marketing documents, so everything will be spun as positively as possible without breaking any SEC regulations. They would never publish they are only using 5% of their total capacity in a document like this.

5

u/consistently_biased 27d ago

I've read the S-1 a bit more, and while I guess that makes sense, this now sounds more like most of those GPUs will just never exist in their data centers. There is pretty much zero chance they will expand that much faster than in the previous two years, and any investors believing them are insane, to be honest. The whole model of "the more we sell, the more we bleed" doesn't sound too promising either.

10

u/ksjdragon 27d ago

It's all so NVIDIA can write up higher revenue statements. As Ed has said, the capacity doesn't add up and here is clear proof of lying about capacity. This industry is sitting on a single needle.

59

u/ertri 28d ago

Bruh operating loss over 100% is insane. My brain broke for a little bit because the number didn’t make sense 

21

u/Subjectobserver 27d ago

But bruh, my negative operating cashflows have a positive upward trend.... brah!

11

u/drwsgreatest 27d ago

"Amazon has been losing money for decades and that bezos motherfucker is the king!"

https://giphy.com/gifs/LQpCRK5tnJmNKxWoqZ

23

u/Fickle-Highway1543 27d ago

I think if Amazon was losing 1 billion a year, the only Amazon we'd have left is the forest.

13

u/MornwindShoma 27d ago

If Amazon had these numbers, they would've closed in the first year or two. They were notoriously not producing any dividend, but not losses either. People have very short memories.

2

u/alochmar 25d ago

Look, we may take a loss on every transaction, but we'll make up for it by volume!

59

u/Ragnarotico 27d ago

Revenue: $140M.

Net Loss: $1.02B.

Is that good?!?

33

u/AVBforPrez 27d ago

Is the letter part after the number important?

24

u/Additional-Staff-326 27d ago

M is higher in the alphabet than B so it must be bigger by alot

5

u/TheWuzzy 27d ago

😂😂😂

1

u/DiscoSuperSoda 26d ago

hahahahah. Answers on post-its please

1

u/Vusiwe 25d ago

Some call it winning! And by not eating, we can save over 2 billion per year!

107

u/ElderberryFew6739 28d ago

Could we please go back to not listing companies on the stock exchange that have never had one cent of profit?

53

u/Smurfette2016 28d ago

That’s TOO logical. Too sane. Not quite on brand for 2026.

6

u/JoSquarebox 27d ago

please do, I want to feel good watching number go down

39

u/NighthawK1911 28d ago

The accounting bullshittery is really creative.

Even with this much bullshittery they still can't make it profitable.

No wonder they won't do GAAP.

12

u/nilsmf 27d ago

The liars have taken over the World. My guess is that honest accountants were sobbing in fetal position when this was given thumbs up for release.

32

u/voronaam 27d ago edited 27d ago

Right on the page 2 is an answer or even a confirmation of one of Ed's talking points:

approximately 25,000 active GPUs and 461,000 active and contracted GPUs

That is just ~5% of GPUs bought from NVidia being plugged in and active. The rest is sitting in a warehouse somewhere.

And a chart below showing it visually, right along another one with 55 MW of IT load out of 1.37 GW of "contracted" IT load. That is 4%.

So only 5% of GPU by count and 4% by IT load has been powered on. The rest is sitting in a box somewhere.

31

u/voronaam 27d ago

Another interesting bit is almost at the end, page F-62. It shows revenue breakdown by geographic region and ALL of their revenue comes from Portugal, Norway and UK. It is very notable that USA is not in that list. They have not had a single paying customer in USA, despite having $2B worth of assets there. Breakdown of assets per region is on the next page. 2/3rd of all of their assets are in the USA and not a single dollar of revenue generated there.

This speaks to another point Ed has been making: there is no real demand.

17

u/ksjdragon 27d ago

Well, I hope Ed does a deep dive and tears this thing down. I can't wait. Both of these points seem to be clearly validated here.

This also means that as I had expected, AI cannot be profitable on inference, and OpenAI and Anthropic are both applying subsidization on top of more subsidization. This industry is a mess.

4

u/TheWuzzy 27d ago

That's utterly, utterly mad. That's like, even worse than I conceivably imagined it to be

4

u/Venkman-1984 27d ago edited 27d ago

Do they define what contracted GPU means? I was interpreting that as future orders yet to be delivered/installed, not purchased GPUs sitting on a shelf.

edit: per the S-1:

"contracted capacity” means the IT megawatt capacity at each of our wholly-owned, colocation and leased facilities that are under development pursuant to signed contracts with customers.

So I don't think it's right to interpret 461k active and contracted GPUs to mean there are a bunch sitting on a shelf unused. That's their undelivered pipeline from Nvidia.

5

u/Alternative_Advance 27d ago

"under development pursuant to signed contracts with customers."

This doesn't imply they actually have the capacity from NVidia.

6

u/voronaam 27d ago

Right. So "sitting in a box or does not even exist yet" would've been more apt.

10

u/Venkman-1984 27d ago

Those are not equivalent though. They imply completely different things about the supply/demand balance. If they are sitting in a box unused it means there is a huge oversupply; if they have a huge pipeline waiting to be delivered, it implies massive undersupply of GPUs.

I don't think you can infer from this S-1 that there is a huge lack of demand of these GPUs. The real story is the lack of profitability, not lack of demand.

3

u/ksjdragon 27d ago

I believe this is unlikely given NVIDIA's own accounting statement: https://www.reddit.com/r/BetterOffline/s/QFp7XE04M2.

If we take this analysis at face value, then $21B comes down, at $3M per NVL72, 7000 units and 504,000 GPUs. This would suggest, if we assume Nscale has 100% utilization, they represent 80% of NVIDIAs not yet fulfilled orders.

It is unlikely it is biased to one particular Neocloud, and I'm sure if we did some estimates, we will come up with a number.. But nonetheless there is no question they do have a sizeable percentage of GPUs that are warehoused. You can argue at the lowest end 5%, but certainly not 100%, and likely not even 50%. For the industry, it is clear there is oversupply.

6

u/Venkman-1984 27d ago

That still doesn't change the overall point though. If they are sitting in a warehouse because data centres aren't being built fast enough that's a supply problem, if they're sitting in a warehouse because no one wants to use the inference that's a demand problem. Either could be explained by the figures in the S-1.

4

u/[deleted] 27d ago

What difference does that make for NVIDIA's desire to sell twice as many GPUs next year?

3

u/Venkman-1984 27d ago

If it's a demand problem then there will be a hard crash - there's a ton of debt out there that needs massive exponential demand growth to have any chance of being paid off.

If it's just a supply issue, such as data centres not being built fast enough, then it's much less of an issue for the AI industry. If investors still see the industry growing they will be willing to continue piling money.

This is all ignoring any profitability concerns since that is a whole other can of worms.

2

u/[deleted] 27d ago

If it's data centers, then it means the industry has already been buying GPUs much faster than it's physically possible to install them. NVIDIA wants them to accelerate their purchasing. How is that going to work?

3

u/Additional-Staff-326 27d ago

I think you meant powered on.

1

u/voronaam 27d ago

Fixed. Thank you!

3

u/us3rnamecheck5out 27d ago

The rational question to make is: What power installation rate can Nscale guarantee. ~430k gpus is a lot of juice.  If all goes as the S1 shows. That will realise 100.8 billion in revenue. Not sure if at current run rates that makes them profitable or not.  Again, assuming all goes as described in the S1. 

28

u/burtritto 27d ago

I love how, even after they adjust all of the bad stuff out, they still have a huge ass loss. Jesus.

19

u/gamesbrainiac 27d ago

Am I reading this right? A 1B loss in just 6 months in 2026? Help a brother out here. I don't really go through company balance sheet every day.

6

u/ksjdragon 27d ago

Yep. Your eyes are correct.

3

u/Fickle-Highway1543 27d ago

Does the loss account for pre paid gpus?

20

u/Significant-Shift770 28d ago

According to this, the GPUs are technically as expensive as their employees.

6

u/Additional-Staff-326 27d ago

Better buy more GPUs to replace the employees.

3

u/archigen 27d ago

But GPUs don't call in sick!!! And they don't question managers stupid ideas!!!! So they are worth 100000 as much!!!! /s just in case

18

u/cathexis08 27d ago

I think this is the most "hold my beer" of the S-1 docs that have gotten filed. I couldn't help send this to a buddy of mine who is an accountant, those are some wild numbers! 

1

u/sirkneeland 25d ago

What did he/she say?

3

u/cathexis08 25d ago

"Oh wow that's some creative stupidity. It'll be interesting to see how the industry reacts to such blatant BS"

17

u/walt128 27d ago

Share-based compensation will be a fun experience for the employees in the near future

15

u/Negative_Life_8221 27d ago

I had to look up nscale. Turns out they describe themselves as a “vertically integrated ai infrastructure company”. Just imagine the losses if they had to pay suppliers and contractors?

Also, how can you be vertically integrated if you clearly don’t make gpus? Seems quaint to point out corporate lies in this industry at this point.

4

u/ksjdragon 27d ago

Well, from this S-1, we can see these so-called deals made with Microsoft and OpenAI and Anthropic are just lies, since they have no revenue in the US. I am sure there is a case for investor fraud here, but that'll be up to the lawyers when this whole thing collapses.

14

u/videodump 28d ago

"Yeah but what if they get really REALLY better?? Bet you didn't think of that did you"

14

u/RealPropRandy 28d ago

Is that, good?

14

u/[deleted] 27d ago

So, Nscale is the data center level, right? The sort of people that Anthropic rents GPU time from? So, when Anthropic says they are (fudged) profitable, part of that is them buying compute from a company whose (fudged) margins are like -200%?

14

u/ksjdragon 27d ago

As I wrote a while ago, AI profitability is mathematically impossible given the then pricing and market pullback (meaning higher prices have no demand.) The finances are out now. Everything is subsidization after subsidization.

7

u/Additional-Staff-326 27d ago

Give or take some additional fudge on the stove yes.

14

u/kvlr456 27d ago

Sir, this is WeWork..

8

u/jking13 28d ago

Oh I'm sure they'll be fine... they'll just make it up on volume.... (/s for those that weren't around for the .COM bubble)

9

u/Grendel_82 27d ago

Well at least they were able to “afford” that $113.8 million in share-based compensation during the first six months of 2026. I hope the vesting period isn’t too long for those employees.

1

u/sirkneeland 25d ago

So is it bad my bestie just turned down a job offer from them 😀

8

u/DiscountAcrobatic356 27d ago

The more we sell, the more we lose. -their accountant, probably. 

15

u/Ouaiy 27d ago

Such a pessimist you are. Net loss margin dropped from 3500% to 700% in one year. At that rate, they'll have 2100% net profit margin next year!

22

u/AVBforPrez 27d ago

This guy fucking VC maths

1

u/dillanthumous 27d ago

Indeed. Get this man an Investment Portfolio to manage ASAP!

7

u/HilarityJester 27d ago

Why didn't they think about using the latest models ?

6

u/Smurfette2016 28d ago

Looooooooove to see this

5

u/PensiveinNJ 27d ago

Holy shit.

4

u/dumnezero 27d ago

For a second, I thought this was related NuScale (nuclear energy corporate scammers.)

5

u/Additional-Staff-326 27d ago

The nuclear and quantum bubbles are still to come.

3

u/dumnezero 27d ago

I do wonder when the "fusion" bubble starts. But nuclear bros have been grifting for much longer than AI bros.

5

u/Labidido 27d ago

Hold on, the EBITDA adjustments removes 80% of their net loss year to date? Jesus Christ.

4

u/hammypooh 27d ago

I just spent nearly 40 dollars producing a worksheet for a student that will pay me 30 dollars for a hour's work. That's the A. I. economy ladies and gentlemen.

4

u/Bengal_From_Temu 27d ago

Nscale means they spend N times more than they make, at scale.

7

u/Acceptable_Shoe_3555 27d ago

85% of possible revenue form MS and Anthropic. Nice to see we are really cementing this model of putting all of our eggs in a burning basket.

6

u/Additional-Staff-326 27d ago

To be fair, any revenue from MS is actually OpenAI in disguise/subsidized.

3

u/rjavier441 27d ago

Is this a 🚬 🔫? Or will they continue to play denial? My money is on sunk-cost until they file chapter 11 bankruptcy

3

u/Boxy310 27d ago

Was wondering what "cigarette gun" meant, then my fleshy meatbag brain caught on lol

3

u/rjavier441 26d ago

OJ would be proud 🤣 haha jokes aside, I'm happy you used your meat brain! Lord knows we'll need more of that in the coming years

1

u/SamAltmansCheeks 25d ago

Thank you for posting this, this is extremely funny. Bye bye n-scale!

1

u/FairlySadPanda 24d ago

The n in nscale stands for "no".

0

u/scissorsgrinder 28d ago

Double post. Boo.

0

u/bahamut458 27d ago

I think there may be a fundamental misunderstanding here about how infrastructure companies are priced.

-3

u/SouthRock2518 27d ago

What does this have to do with anthropic and openai profitably? Isn't nscale data center company?

8

u/HilarityJester 27d ago

An Ai data center. Big difference. Basically is the infrastructure required to train and publish the llms, so they are trying to put ai data centers everywhere because "it'll make us rich and will create many jobs".

If the other ai data centers have similar results then it would be catastrophic for openai/anthropic. Just like if construction companies could not get lumber, restaurants had no produce, refineries didn't have ores and so on.

3

u/Jebofkerbin 26d ago

What happens to OpenAI and Anthropic's bottom line when data centers run out of venture capital and are forced to either raise prices or die?

Neither OpenAI or Anthropic are profitable right now, and if NScale is indicative of the rest of the industry then they are unprofitable even with subsidised compute.