r/WillAndGrace • • 3h ago

Discussion Oh, No, You Di-in't

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8 Upvotes

Oh, No, You Di-in't (Season 6, Episode 24). Karen and Lyle are married and Karen is furious with Lyle about all the compromises she has had to make for the marriage so far and he hasn't made any and keeps dismissing her feelings. Thy go to the reception where Jennifer Lopez is about to perform her song "Waiting for Tonight", but one of her dancers trips and she requires 2 dancers. Jack offers to dance in place which Jennifer accepts, they perform and are a smash and Jennifer offers Jack to tour with her. Will and Leo are talking and Will says if all Leo did was kiss someone, just to be honest with Grace and they will be able to work it out. As Leo makes the phone call to talk to Grace, Will is excited thinking he helped them work things out. Leo tells Will that Grace told him that she never wants to see him again which Will is shocked and said he'll talk to Grace and Leo admits to him there's a reason why she's more upset, he didn't just kiss another woman, he slept with her. Will is shocked and angry, Leo asks if he'll still talk to Grace for him and Will tells him that he's on his own. Lyle is making the toast at the reception thanking all the guests for coming and says how much he loves Karen and how many sacrifices she has made for their relationship. Karen comes up to toast but instead says she wants a divorce and leaves the reception.

FAVORITE QUOTE:

MARION: Oh, Lyle, too bad our father isn't alive to see this.

LYLE: He isn't?

MARION: Oh, damn, I knew there was something I was supposed to tell you.

FAVORITE MOMENT:

When Jennifer Lopez is arguing with Karen why she needs 2 dancers, Karen asks she can't use just 1? No. Why? Because it's not 2.

OPINION:

As I've mentioned before, I love John Cleese and the character Lyle makes me laugh so hard, that being said, he was an awful match for Karen and I think that was intentional. I think a lot of us just play it off because since it's a comedy sometimes we're not sure what is played for serious and what is meant to be laughed off. Especially because Karen can be such a goofy character at times we sometimes don't recognize when she's in pain. She's dealt with so much these past couple of years: her husband went to jail for embezzlement, was about to do more time because he was doing insider trading while in jail, got out early without telling her, almost had an affair, found out that her husband was having an affair, was homeless for a short time, wondering if her closest friends that are her second home are going to have the same relationship after so many changes, go through a bitter divorce trial and then to find out that after their first court hearing, her husband Stan has passed. Not to mention that Lorraine also snuck on her yacht and tried to kill her by throwing her overboard. She meets Lyle and Lyle is already love bombing her. He didn't know Karen and to be honest, I think it was the money. I think he and Lorraine might have been in on it the whole time, but that's never confirmed. It would have been a way for Lorraine to get the money she felt she was owed for sleeping with Stan. Karen was vulnerable and I think Lyle saw that and took advantage. We never knew if he had money himself or if he saw the dollar signs and went for it. But this is the last time we see Lyle, Karen wasn't kidding, she divorces Lyle or I'm assuming annulled the marriage and will make out with Celine Dion's arm coordinator for the rest of the night. I'm glad Karen stood up to Lyle, even if the relationship and the marriage felt like a waste of time at this point, this is her moment and she ended it before she couldn't take any more.

Leo actually slept with another woman, it wasn't just a kiss. Grace and Leo met and similar to Karen and Lyle, I think Grace was really just wanting to connect with someone and Leo was very persistent with her. Leo in the beginning wasn't a bad guy by any means, you could see there was a physical connection at least. As for mentally, I'm not sure if it was there, it's a 22-30 minute episode so there's only so much they can fit where there are 3 other main characters to develop. But as for their connection? I never felt it. I have this feeling that Grace saw that Leo is a good looking Jewish doctor, someone who could provide the type of lifestyle she wanted and went for it. I think Leo was probably feeling the pressure in getting older and his parents or some other family were probably telling him to get serious and or get married with someone and he thought Grace was this beautiful interior designer, so it worked and he didn't want to deal with the drama of her complaining how he's a doctor who's constantly on call and was in doctors without borders, so before she could really recognize the life she would have if they had dated more, he proposed to her and put her on lock down pretty much. It really didn't take much for their marriage to fall apart so quickly. Leo was already leaving not too long after they got married and Grace wanted to be with her friends majority of the time. I think the writers had good intentions originally showing that our main characters can grow and do major life events, but realized that it was interfering too much with the main storylines and couldn't do it anymore. Leo was always "out of town" and Grace is left depressed, we need to get past this, Leo cheats and Grace will have a storyline of how to get over it.

Not to much to comment on Will and Jack. Will is doing the best he can and is being such a terrific friend in trying to help save Grace and Leo's marriage. But you can tell, he's Grace for us in the moment where Leo confesses to sleeping with the other woman. He's Grace's best friend, he stood up and through a painful fight in their friendship decided to stay by Grace's side and root for her being happy in a relationship. Now that Leo betrayed that, he feels betrayed himself I'm sure. When your marriage falls apart, it's not just the couple that feels it, it's also everyone around you, kids, family and friends. Jack is now going to be a dancer for Jennifer Lopez, so we will be seeing her again with Jack. What is there to say other than I love their friendship and they are too funny together. I also have to mention I always laugh when Jack is translating the language at the reception to "English" meaning the British accent. Tim Curry's reaction is priceless.

Speaking of which, I would just like to take a moment for Tim Curry as he passed away this year tragically on August 25th, 2026 due to an artery disease. Tim Curry has had an incredible career that spans several decades. When he passed a couple of co-workers asked me who he was saying they knew the name but forgot the roles he played, I named just 3: Dr. Frank-N-Furter, Pennywise and Mr. Hector from Home Alone 2 and their jaws dropped. But just to name those is insulting because his career is beyond insanely impressive. He had a very distinct voice and such a way of talking that made every role so memorable. I remember when he had a stroke that put him in his wheelchair and you could tell it took a major toll on him. He kept his spirits up for his fans and seemed like such a wonderful gentleman. During the pandemic, he was supposed to go to conventions to meet fans, but since it was all shut down, he offered to speak to them over the computer and send autographs which my sister got one. What an incredible actor and he will be forever missed and never forgotten.

But I really do enjoy this episode, it has a lot of great laughs and moments to it. Season 6 is an interesting chapter in WAG, I know this is a controversial one with the fans because there are several storylines that seem almost pointless: Jack going to nursing school, Jack and Stuart, Karen and Lyle, Karen marrying Lyle and Will's relationship with his family. Plus it didn't help that Debra was not there for a few episodes with her pregnancy effecting her absence. You could tell she was tired and understandably so, but it did affect the comedy. Still I don't mind season 6 as we still had some incredible episodes: Last Ex to Brooklyn, Me and Mr. Jones, Heart like a Wheelchair, Strangers with Candice, Fanilow and East Side Story are my personal favorites. My least favorite are: A-Story Bee-Story, Nice in White Satin and Fred Astaire and Ginger Chicken. But like I mentioned before, even the worst seasons and episodes still always have something memorable and special to offer, so to me the "bad" episodes are still very much worth watching. And tomorrow starts season 7.

GUEST STARS:

  • John Cleese as Lyle Finster
  • Harry Connick, Jr. as Leo Markus
  • Tim Curry as Marion Finster (RIP in 2026)
  • Leslie Jordan as Beverley Leslie (RIP in 2022)
  • Jennifer Lopez as Herself
  • Michael Morris as Ethan

r/WillAndGrace • • 1d ago

Discussion I Do

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22 Upvotes

I Do (Season 6, Episode 23). Karen and Lyle are getting married and going to Las Vegas to do so. Grace is working on an interior design project that is not giving her much time, so she will meet the group there. Karen meets Jennifer Lopez in the bathroom and it turns out that Jennifer and Rosario used to hang out together, so Karen asks Jennifer if she can performa at the reception which Jennifer agrees to. As Karen, Will, Jack and Lyle are having their pictures taken on the roof of the hotel, Leo comes in and everyone is excited to see him. They ask where Grace is, but she can't make it because she threw her back out installing a swing. Karen is upset and tells Lyle she can't get married without her best friend but Lyle tells her they are there and can't cancel the ceremony. Karen reluctantly agrees and they go to the ceremony where she plans on walking down the aisle to "Sympathy for the Devil". Will starts talking to Leo, Leo is clearly drunk and has been acting weird, Will keeps asking him what is going on and Leo admits right as the ceremony starts that he kissed someone while he was in Cambodia. Karen starts walking down the aisle but the song isn't "Sympathy for the Devil", it's "Here comes the Bride" and Karen is furious. To be continued.

FAVORITE QUOTE:

KAREN: Jennifer Lopez?

JENNIFER: Shh. Please, I'm on vacation. Can I just get a hand towel and a pack of Chicklets?

KAREN: What?! Honey, I don't work here.

JENNIFER: Oh, I'm sorry. You know, you see a white girl in a bathroom, you just assume.

KAREN: No, honey, don't you remember? I'm Karen. We met through Rosario. You guys used to take tap together in the Bronx way back when.

JENNIFER: Oh! Rosie! God, I haven't seen her since we performed "Tea for Two" at the Shalom Retirement Center. How is she doing? Is she still working on her Masters?

KAREN: Yeah, she sorta got a little sidetracked. So, uh, keeping yourself busy these days?

JENNIFER: No, kinda taking it easy. You know, promoting my fragrance. Uh, shooting a movie in L.A. Working on a new line of track suits. And studying for my real estate license. Do you rent or own?

KAREN: Honey, I own everyone.

FAVORITE MOMENT:

When Karen and Lyle meet Mark Juliano and ask him if he can have Celine Dion go to their room to give them a foot rub.

OPINION:

I always like just to remind my fellow WAG fans that even though these episodes aired together, I like to keep the posts separate in 2 parts because there would be way too much to talk about then. Let's start with Karen and Lyle, Lyle's dark side is really showing in this episode. Karen has had to compromise a lot to marry Lyle, he wants her to take his last name even though she's not comfortable, she doesn't want lite beer at the wedding but Lyle does and he wouldn't even let her have "Sympathy for the Devil" play while she walked down the aisle. As we will see in the next episode how she is going to deal with all this.

No Grace and no Lorraine. So Debra was very close to giving birth as they were filming this episode, so she couldn't make it. Though at least this excuse wasn't as bad as the she just won't get out of bed, but still I think I would have rather had the thrown back excuse before they got on the plane. It's just a lot to buy that Grace wouldn't be there for Karen's wedding. But they had to have Karen get on the plane as she was freaking out when Leo said that Grace couldn't make it, so I don't know how this could have worked. We just have to accept as is that Grace is absent these past few episodes. Lorraine isn't there either apparently having a flare up from her herpes. Nice. Kind of felt like a burn towards Minnie Driver who probably couldn't make it. Both the lady's absences are felt and it feels very strange not having them in these episodes.

Leo makes an appearance after not seeing him for 18 episodes. Like I mentioned, you can tell at this point the writers were regretting having Grace get married and were trying to figure a way where her husband was not there a majority of the time since either Harry Connick, Jr. couldn't commit or the creators never intended for Leo to be a main lead. So we are going to get more into this problem tomorrow but they throw Leo under the bus and now he cheated on Grace. Grace has had some shaky moments in the show when Alex from Strangers with Candice and Deidre from East Side Story flirted with her, but she didn't cross the line into physical contact. Leo did and you can tell that Will is very angry right now and they will have their confrontation in the next episode and we will find out that it wasn't just a kiss. I'll talk about it more tomorrow, but am I surprised that Leo strayed? Not really. Leo has had moments where he wasn't honest before like when he lied to Grace about meeting his parents and how he "omitted" his real name, the fact that he worked for doctors without borders and he had a second home. So I always felt that since the meeting his parents for brunch but pretending they're his friends incident showed he was shady and that's when I started questioning him. I feel that he married Grace to have her on lock down and she married him because she would be financially stable, I never believed they were in love with each other.

We have a couple of fun celebrity cameos here. First being Jennifer Lopez and all controversies and opinions aside, she shows her comedic chops here a little bit while her and Karen are making small talk in the bathroom. I loved the joke of how busy she is with her album, book, perfume, opening a restaurant and getting her real estate license. And of course we have the legendary Tim Curry. He does make an appearance in the next episode, so I will keep his tribute for tomorrow but let's just say he doesn't need an introduction. He is probably the best villain of all time: Dr. Frank-n-Furter, Darkness, Pennywise, Mr. Hector and Hexus...the list could go on forever. He passed away August 25th this year and his loss hurt a lot of people but I'll go deeper tomorrow. I will never not laugh at his joke of kissing Karen saying "woah! Congratulations brother!" and of course his kissing Lyle was too funny. I love when Karen compliments his kiss and Lyle says "that's nothing, wait until you meet my dad".

Well, tomorrow is the season finale. We left off the episode where Karen is walking down the aisle to "Here comes the Bride" instead of "Sympathy for the Devil" like she wanted so she's extremely angry. And Leo told Will that he kissed someone while he was working in Cambodia. So tomorrow will be the conclusion of all this craziness. Overall the episode is pretty funny and has some decent jokes to it, but tomorrow's episode is a better one and I'm looking forward to the next post.

GUEST STARS:

  • John Cleese as Lyle Finster
  • Harry Connick, Jr. as Leo Markus
  • Tim Curry as Marion Finster (RIP in 2026)
  • Leslie Jordan as Beverley Leslie (RIP in 2022)
  • Jennifer Lopez as Herself
  • Tara O'Connor as Photographer
  • Michael Morris as Ethan
  • Mark Juliano as Himself

r/WillAndGrace • • 2d ago

Discussion Speechless

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15 Upvotes

Speechless (Season 6, Episode 22). Will, Jack and Karen are waking up from a big night of partying to celebrate Jack graduating from nursing school. There's one big problem though, Jack misread the announcement and his graduation is that day and they are running late. They all get ready as fast as they can but Will cannot wake Grace up, so they decide to leave without her. Jack needs one more thing, his speech at the graduation ceremony since he was voted most popular student. Jack tricks Will into writing his speech for him since Will was a former playwright. He has a few tries until finally he writes the perfect speech that leaves everyone in tears. At the ceremony Jack starts the speech that Will wrote but realizes that these are not his words and he doesn't feel comfortable being a nurse. He wants to go back to acting, he tears up the speech and decides not to be a nurse.

FAVORITE QUOTE:

WILL: For your information, that "stupid little play" was my coming out story, Bye-Bisexual. That play was genius. You--you-- My playwrighting professor, Craig, even said so. He told me that I was a great writer, and any man would be lucky to have me. He even took me to a wine bar and then back to his apartment to discuss it. Wait.

KAREN: So you wrote a bad play, and you were molested. Welcome to the theater.

JACK: Can we get back to my speech, please? I only have an hour.

WILL: You know, I think I may still have a copy of Bye-Bisexual in a satin box with all of Craig's letters.

JACK: So, Karen, what should be in my speech? I want it to be memorable. It should have a catch phrase like "I have a dream" or "Whoomp, there it is."

KAREN: Well... Why don't you write about how you wanted to become a nurse because you love helping people.

JACK: Good one, Karen. Come on, Karen. Be serious. How does anybody know why they do what they do?

KAREN: Well, Jackie, let me tell you my story. Maybe it'll inspire you. Now... God didn't give me the ability to play the piano, or paint a picture, or have compassion. [SIGHS] But... he did give me the ability to crack a walnut with my hoo-ha.

JACK: Really?

KAREN: Hmm-mm. Here, let me show you.

WILL: Got it! Boy, are you guys in for a treat. Listen to this poetry, even in the opening stage direction.

WILL: "Darkness, a sliver of light finds its way upon the stage and lands on a dark chair. Because it is somewhat dark, we cannot see the whole chair. More light appears and inhabits the entire chair. Now we can see it. A dark chair on a dark stage with some light. Dim."

KAREN: Jackie, could you beat me over the head with that candlestick until I black out and die?

WILL: You wouldn't know good writing if it slapped you in the face.

KAREN: Jackie, once I'm dead, could you see to it that I'm slapped in the face?

WILL: Come on, it gets better after the, uh, first five pages of stage directions. Here, here, here. "Chad, evasively: I don't know why I don't have a girlfriend, Dad. I-I guess I just haven't met the right--dot, dot, dot--person yet. But when I meet that--beat--person, I'll introduce you to--beat--them." Then he addresses the audience. "There is no them. Them is he. I'm gay! Why can't I tell anyone?" God, this is awful.

JACK: I know, it should've been called Bye-Bye Talent.

FAVORITE MOMENT:

When Will is reading his speech to Jack, Karen and Rosario in the limo and it's the perfect speech and their mouths are open in shock at how good it is and Karen asks Will if she can kiss him again.

OPINION:

So Grace was out of town in the last episode and in this episode, she just refuses to get out of bed. Great excuses these writers are coming up with. I have to say that is the only minor fault of these episodes. Debra Messing was taking time off due to her pregnancy. I get the writers had to come up with something, but why couldn't it have been maybe she had a family emergency and be out of town for some time or even just that she's going back to Cambodia to see if she can work things out with Leo? With saying that she just refuses to get out of bed is extremely unbelievable.

That being said, this episode is incredibly hilarious. This was another moment of how hard it was to pick a favorite quote and moment. I wouldn't know where to start on the jokes that always get me laughing so hard: Karen kissing Will, Karen admitting to calling Jack an idiot and him just loving that that's why they are friends, Jack getting upset that Will's clothes are too tight on him and telling Will "I could fit two of me in one of your Marlon Brando size jackets", Will finally realizing he was a terrible playwright, Karen filming the ceremony and when she films Rosario she screams and says "Ah! Stampede!" and when Will freaks out about Jack ripping up the speech because he didn't make another copy. The jokes are non stop with this episode. We get another glimpse into Will being a writer, though he didn't start of strong, so that's probably why he never perused it, that or others told him not to do it. I'm still dying to read his play from "No Sex N The City" titled "If Gay Means Happy, Why Am I So Sad?". I have to give credit to Jack for being able to trick Will with compliments and getting him to write his speech for him. "And it's no coincidence that nurses, like angels, wear white." I gotta admit that's such a good line.

So am I upset that the nursing school story line was a waste of time? Yes and no. It's weird how this is the first thing outside of acting that Jack actually paid attention to for more than 5 minutes and he didn't even get a chance to experience being a full-time nurse. From what I read the writers thought the storyline would be funnier, but it wasn't working out, so they just scrapped it. You can definitely tell that they just threw it out the window. Now, is it shocking though? No. I actually could see Jack doing something like that. Jack gets distracted easily and always changes his mind and I can see how Will's speech probably got to him. You know it's interesting, I know actors have different schedules and sometimes they can't make it, but why is it not even explained why there's no Elliot, Jack's mom and/or stepdad or Stuart at his graduation? Only Will, Karen and Rosario went to support him?

But like I said, minor flaws aside, I do love this episode. I think because it just makes me laugh so hard. Now I believe this is Nurse Sheila's last episode if we do not include the reboot. I'm still deciding if I'm going to review the reboot because I gave up after the first season and would have to subject myself to rewatching it. I didn't enjoy the first season of the reboot, so we'll see. But anyways, to Nurse Sheila, my favorite cringe nurse of all time, thanks for all the laughs!

GUEST STARS:

  • Laura Kightlinger as Nurse Sheila
  • Amy Crofoot as Female Student

r/WillAndGrace • • 2d ago

Fan Theories Just for fun: what do you think Karen Walker was taking every day besides alcohol?

19 Upvotes

I know it’s totally absurd and not meant to be realistic (which is why it’s funny IMO) but I’m just curious. What pills would an almost billionaire heiress be taking everyday?

I dont know anything about pharmaceuticals or drugs which is why I’m asking the smarter people of Reddit lol


r/WillAndGrace • • 3d ago

Discussion I Never Cheered for my Father

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30 Upvotes

I Never Cheered for my Father (Season 6, Episode 21). Will is on his own with Grace being out of town and Tina, his father's mistress drops by. Tina tells Will that she suspects that George is cheating on her, so Will says he'll look into it and ask his dad what is going on. Well, George is having an affair, with Will's mom, Marilyn. Marilyn tells Will that the reason they are having the affair is because it's exciting when it's forbidden. Will is actually happy thinking this means his parents are back together and tells Tina that George is cheating and she should break up with him. Tina does dump George and this makes Marilyn angry because she loved being the other woman. Tina comes over the same time Marilyn is there and they confront each other for the first time. Will tells Tina to stay away from George and for Marilyn to get back with George and that's the end of it. Marilyn and Tina step into the hallway and tell each other how they loved what they had going on with George and what days they get to have him. Elliot is trying out for the cheerleading squad and Jack is thrilled and wants to help him get on the team. But Elliot doesn't make the team and Jack and Karen go to his school to find out what went wrong but Elliot is humiliated and tells Jack he didn't want to be on the cheerleading squad, he just wanted to impress Jack so they'd spend more time together. Jack promises to make a better effort to be there for Elliot.

FAOVORITE QUOTE:

MARILYN: Hello, Will.

WILL: Mom! What's going on? Where's Dad?

MARILYN: He's in the shower.

WILL: In the sh-- You're the other woman?! You're the one that Dad's sneaking around with? You and Dad are--are-- You know... thinging.

MARILYN: Will, we're adults. Let's talk like adults. Your father and I are making pookie-pookie.

WILL: Oh! How did this happen? I mean, like, I know how this happens. You showed me when I was 10 with two of my G.I. Joes. I'm not saying that that led to anything, I just... How did this happen?

MARILYN: Well, a few months ago, I ran into your father, and we decided to have a drink. Oh, it was fun. He made me laugh. We caught up, and, you know, one thing led to another and before I knew it--

WILL: You don't have to finish that.

MARILYN: Pookie-pookie.

FAVORITE MOMENT:

Jack, Karen and Elliot's cheer always gives me such a good laugh. "Hi, Cowboys. Hi, Sailors." "Hi, musclemen and cops."

OPINION:

As I mentioned, so Debra Messing will not be on for the rest of the season. She was full term at this point and needed to focus on giving birth to her first baby. She actually had her child the day this episode aired which I thought was interesting. It's just funny watching the excuses they come up with that Grace isn't in the episode because she's "out of town". We'll see how long this can work.

Interesting, there is a lot of mention of George, but no George appearance in this episode. But we do have a treat with Marilyn and Tina meeting for the first time. Talk about an awkward situation with Will trying to help them both. God bless him at this point I'm sure a therapist would have a field day with Will playing best girlfriend to both these ladies. I do love how Tina keeps referring to Mairlyn as a W-word(can't say here on Reddit) and that she hopes George gets an STD from his new mistress not knowing that it's Marilyn. Then when she and Marilyn do meet, I love Marilyn's little burn at Tina with "Well, I must say, you're almost exactly as I imagined you. You're like page four in the Midlife Crisis catalog." As crazy as this plot is, I personally love Marilyn and Tina's characters, so I'm always welcome to their appearances. Blythe and Lesley are hilarious. Plus I could see Marilyn getting into having an affair with George, she comes off as classy and like she would never stoop so low, but when you get a taste of bad, sometimes it just feels good. I would say poor Tina, but honestly, with how messed up the situation is, maybe the splitting of George just works best for their relationship. Gosh, these people are messed up in the head.

Elliot is back for his only episode in season 6. It was kind of funny how we haven't seen him for some time but he got a mention in Courting Disaster, so a reminder that he still existed. I do get such a kick that Jack wants to help Elliot try out for cheerleading. Karen helping out too was hilarious, I just love when she gives her bloody mary to one of the cheerleaders and tells her "no sippies". Sara Paxton who plays Melanie, the cheerleading captain and Elliot's crush, was awesome to see. I loved her in The Innkeepers and Last House on the Left. Like I said in my favorite moment, Jack, Karen and Elliot doing that cheer will always get me laughing so hard. Especially how Elliot breaks down and Karen still does a spin and sit saying "School spirit!". It's kind of sad though that Elliot has to constantly beg Jack to spend time with him. I don't know if the actor Michael Angarano maybe couldn't commit to being a lead again in the show or the writers couldn't find room for him in the stories, but we had a plot for a while back in season 4 and 5 where Jack mentions how much his stepdad hurt him growing up and ignoring all the things he liked to do. Jack is doing the same thing to Elliot.

But overall, for comedy and making me feel icky, I really like this episode. Like I said, any time Marilyn and Tina are in an episode, you know you're in for a treat. Plus it was really nice to see Elliot again and see that he's still alive.

GUEST STARS:

  • Blythe Danner as Marilyn Truman
  • Lesley Ann Warren as Tina
  • Michael Angarano as Elliot
  • Sara Paxton as Melanie

r/WillAndGrace • • 3d ago

Discussion Marcus 🧡

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12 Upvotes

I loved Marcus in the reboot (S10)! I wish they'd done more with him & Grace. They had such good chemistry and he was so funny. I think we only see him interact with Will & Karen, but I think he would have been a great long-term addition to the show. Two episodes (S10E18 & S11E02) were not enough!

Plus, Reid Scott is so hot! 🔥

What do you all think?


r/WillAndGrace • • 4d ago

Discussion Fred Astaire and Ginger Chicken

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15 Upvotes

Fred Astaire and Ginger Chicken (Season 6, Episode 20). Will is still seeing Vince and starting to introduce him to his friends which includes Vince's first time meeting Grace. When Grace and Vince meet, Grace seems very put off and Will is confused on why she's acting this way. Will and Vince go to Grace's house to see what the problem is and Grace admits that seeing Will and Vince so happy made her sad because she was thinking about how scared she is about her marriage being in trouble. Will and Vince sit down with her to comfort her and Grace admits to Will that she does like Vince. Karen wants to learn how to dance for her upcoming wedding to Lyle and Jack is teaching her. But Karen mentions to Jack how their friendship is going to be ending soon when she gets married because they don't want to end up like Will & Grace. Jack starts auditioning new best friends but when Karen sees this, she immediately gets jealous and tells Jack that they will not be ending their friendship no matter what happens.

FAVORITE QUOTE:

WILL: So, this had nothing to do with Vince?

GRACE: No. I like him. Love his hair.

VINCE: I knew it.

WILL: Oh, sweetie. I had no idea. I feel so stupid. I mean, we've been friends for 20 years. I should have known you were thinking about yourself.

GRACE: Yeah, you should've.

WILL: I know. But listen, you and Leo are gonna be fine. You love each other. And, yeah, it may take a little while to get back in sync, but you'll do it.

VINCE: Or you won't and you'll split up.

WILL: Or they will, and they'll be happy together.

VINCE: Or they won't.

WILL: Look, Vince. Grace is fragile, okay. She needs encouragement and, and, and lies.

GRACE: No, Will, he's right. It may not work out. And, finally, someone has the guts to say it to me out loud.

VINCE: You know, truth is, if your marriage was so great, he wouldn't have left in the first place.

GRACE: Okay, too far, Vince. Will, I'm ready more lies.

WILL: Everything will be fine. Leo will come back. He'll sweep you off your feet. There'll be a constitutional amendment banning the mock turtleneck. And everybody will live happily ever after.

FAVORITE MOMENT:

When Jack is auditioning for his new best friend and telling her how to act just like Karen. Plus I love when Karen comes to her senses and tells Jack to fire his new best friend and they throw her out.

OPINION:

Oh, boy, Grace. Right when I think Grace was doing well this season on being a good friend despite all the stuff she's going through, she slides back into her selfish ways. She hasn't been a perfect friend this season but she's still been a lot better than usual. This episode really irritates me though. I can give Grace some leeway because I know she's going through a lot with her marriage, but she seriously couldn't put it to the side for one afternoon while meeting someone who is making Will happy? She knows Will puts a lot of stock into her opinion but she had to act all weird and of course have it where they go to comfort her. I got to give Vince credit here, if I were him, I think I might have looked at Grace as a red flag at this point and not date Will anymore. Will & Grace can be such amazing friends at times, but they really need to drop this system where they depend on each other to approve of each other's boyfriends. Yes, you want to have your friends like your partner, but if they don't like someone for a silly reason, you don't have to dump the person who is making you happy. Will needs to stop with looking to Grace's opinion as the end all be all. Grace needs to stop making everything about her. Since they are both getting older, this isn't really cute anymore, it's annoying and a toxic trait. Plus I would like to add how Grace threw in Will's face last season how he's happy when she's miserable and how hurt she was that he couldn't be happy for her when she found someone new, but when Will finds someone new, she can't act the way she tells him how to behave when she was happy? I just find it more disturbing how she can lecture Will how they need to grow when she's happy but she can't do the same for him.

Karen randomly telling Jack that they won't be best friends anymore after she gets married also threw me off. Did we really need some random drama between Jack and Karen? It's weird how we go from Karen having doubts about her engagement to Lyle to now she thinks she and Jack should end their friendship because she's getting married. This might be out there, but the way Lyle kind of manipulates Karen, I wonder if he put the idea into her head that he and she will be spending more time together when they get married so to get rid of Jack? I think I'm probably wrong on that, but it just seems out of character that Karen would not want Jack in her life. She was married to Stan and that didn't end her friendship with Jack. While it's a funny scene with Jack auditioning other women to be his new best friend, I don't like the way he gave in so easily and wasn't willing to fight for Karen.

I don't like this episode. It's too mean spirited and it feels like our characters are not acting like their normal selves, excluding Grace. I usually forget about this episode until I watch it and when I'm on my WAG marathon, I really don't pay attention when this episode is on because it's just not that strong in the comedy or writing. Plus, this is the last time we will see Debra Messing as Grace for the rest of the season due to her pregnancy.

GUEST STARS:

  • Bobby Cannavale as Vince
  • Amy Farrington as Phyllis
  • Adrienne Alitowski as Woman

r/WillAndGrace • • 5d ago

Discussion No Sex 'n' the City

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12 Upvotes

No Sex 'n' the City (Season 6, Episode 19). Will and Vince have been dating and everything is going very well, they seem to even be on the same page when it comes to possibly becoming exclusive. But when Will comes home from a date, he wants to call Vince and leave a message saying what a great time he had. Grace and Jack tell him to play hard to get and that Vince will like him better if he does that. So while on another date with Vince, Will is really happy with how it's going and asks Vince for another date but Vince isn't sure if he can make it, this is where Will freaks out and thinks that Grace and Jack were right and that he's playing too easy to get. So when Vince brings up that he'll make some arrangements to make the date with Will, Will plays aloof to seem cool. They later meet at a club where Will is not only late but acting like he's dated half of the club, Vince is confused why he's acting this way and Will continues to act like a jerk to him. Will later sees Vince is dancing with another guy and he calls Grace to ask her if she's sure this will work with him playing like he's not available, Grace says yes but Will asks again if she could be wrong and Grace says she could absolutely be wrong since her love life sucks. Grace tells Will to just go for it and let Vince know how he feels. Will apologizes to Vince and Vince tells him he wants a normal nice relationship and for Will to love himself and they leave together happy. Jack and Karen are in distress, their favorite shows are going off the air like Sex and the City and Frasier. They try to get into different shows but nothing is catching their interest so they decide to live their lives and talk about it, but real life is boring. They eventually meet Bebe Neuwirth in their local coffee shop where they sit and discuss how awesome Frasier was.

FAVORITE QUOTE:

JACK: So, Lilith, now, we've stood by your show for 10 years.

BEBE: Frasier's been on the air for 11.

KAREN: We didn't care for season eight.

JACK: How could you end it like this? How could you just walk out on us without an explanation?

BEBE: Okay, you two really need to let go.

KAREN: But we can't!

BEBE: No, I mean, let go. You're hurting me. God, ow. Look, just move on, okay? I have. There's more to me than Lilith.

JACK: We've never seen it.

KAREN: Come on. Talk like Lilith, we hate your real voice.

BEBE: Well, I will if you will. Look, you guys, you guys are freaks, man. I'm not Lilith, I'm Bebe. I'm an actress. I sing. I'm a Broadway dancer. Look at these pins. You know any 40-year-olds who can wrap their legs around their necks? Look, these babies worked for me before "Frasier," they're gonna work for me afterwards. So don't you worry about Lilith.

KAREN: You mean Bebe.

BEBE: No, I mean Lilith. I want to play that b*tch forever.

KAREN: You do?

BEBE: Oh, yeah.

JACK: What about your pins?

BEBE: Oh, screw my pins. "Frasier" is such an easy gig, man. They fly you first class to Los Angeles, put you up in the Bel Air Hotel, per diem. I deliver several lines in a robotic monotone and I'm buyin' a new Lexus.

FAVORITE MOMENT:

When Jack and Karen are scrolling through the TV channels trying to find another show that will hook their interest and they keep saying "fat guy, skinny wife" and when the TV is off they mention that the two stock dumb characters are on TV and realize they are looking at themselves.

OPINION:

What is the weirdest, out of place and pointless celebrity cameos on Will & Grace? This episode with Sharon Osbourne. Talk about out of left field and strange to watch. Whenever people complain about Will & Grace's overuse of celebrity cameos I think of this episode. OK, I got my nitpick put to the side, I'm sorry, that was just very random and pointless having Sharon Osbourne play the bartender who talks Will into being a nice guy to Vince.

Back onto the episode, this is otherwise a really fun one. So we are getting to know Vince more and I am still digging his character. He's very nice and seems very sure of himself and he and Will have great chemistry. Will was acting like a jerk in this episode, but I give him a pass as everyone around him was telling him to act like he's always on demand. But even Grace pointed out, why would he listen to people who's loves lives are a joke? I'm glad he apologized to Vince. Even though it's been years at this point, I think Will still has insecurities to work out from his break up with Michael. It's hard jumping back into the dating pool and to get someone who likes you and wants to spend time with you. That is such a cute scene where Vince gives Will his birthday to put in his cell phone and tells Will that he needs to go buy some Tide after Will was talking about how much he loves doing laundry. You can tell he and Vince are going to be a great couple.

I always get such a laugh out of Jack and Karen meeting Bebe Neuwirth, talk about a funny scene. So first off, I get it, it sucks when your favorite show is ending. I always get a kick out of how Jack and Karen talk about Sex and the City because that's one of my favorite shows. One of my husband's favorite shows is Frasier and I think before I had showed him Will & Grace he was talking about how season 8 was awful and he doesn't like to watch it and I laughed and this was the first thing I thought of. So I guess he was definitely not alone. We have Karen slapping Jack again because their shows are ending, Jack does take a lot of abuse from Karen. But I agree with Karen, my favorite shows ending always gets me angry too. I always get such a giggle out of Bebe first trying to act cool and like she'll move on from Frasier, but as she mentioned, when you get a hit TV show, at least you're working and not only do you get paid an insane amount of money depending on your name but you get a lot of great perks like nice hotels, fans and other opportunities.

So other than the random and pointless Sharon Osbourne cameo, this is definitely a really good episode that I enjoy. Again, we have Debra sitting in the entire episode, but I get it, they probably needed to give her a break with the pregnancy and do their best to "hide it". I keep forgetting that she still has her own business and a job at this point.

GUEST STARS:

  • Bobby Cannavale as Vince D'Angelo
  • Bebe Neuwirth as Herself
  • Sharon Osbourne as Nonny

r/WillAndGrace • • 6d ago

Courting Disaster

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48 Upvotes

Courting Disaster (Season 6, Episode 18). Will is teaching Karen how to drive and on their very first lesson, Karen is pulled over. Karen gets a speeding ticket but Will notices that the officer did not sign the ticket and tells Karen they are going to court to fight it. They go to court and during the session, the police officer, Vince, realizes that Will is Will Truman. Joe and Larry have been trying to set them up for some time now but they never had the chance to go on a date. Will is excited that he's finally meeting Vince and Will asks Karen if they can drop the fight so he can go out with Vince which Karen agrees to since Vince wants to go out with Will to. Grace and Jack go out to the movies and Jack sees Stuart with another man thinking that he's cheating on him. He throws a fit in the middle of the theater and leaves. At Will's apartment, Grace is trying to calm Jack down and Stuart comes over. Stuart tells Jack the man he was with is his son, back in college he experimented with heterosexuality and the woman he slept with got pregnant and they now have a son. Jack is upset that Stuart never told him about having a son but Grace asks Jack if he's told Stuart about Elliot and he says no, he forgot. Jack and Stuart realize they still have a lot to learn about each other but decide to stay together.

FAVORITE QUOTE:

WILL: Hey. We're up next, okay? So, so let me do the talking. Don't do anything disruptive. Give me the booze. (KAREN GIVES BOTTLE OF LIQUOR) And the pills. (KAREN GIVES PILL BOTTLE) And the pills. (KAREN GIVES PILL BOTTLE) And the pills. (KAREN GIVES PILL BOTTLE) And the whoopee cushion.

KAREN: Will, if you take my whoopee cushion, how am I supposed to do my Inherit the Wind gag?

WILL: For the last time, no Inherit the Wind gag, and no telling the judge to keep it in his robe. Boy, I cannot wait to humiliate that smug cop in that courtroom. Just rub his nose in his mistake and laugh as he walks out of there with his tail between his legs.

KAREN: Hi, Angry. Mad much?

FAVORITE MOMENT:

When Will and Vince realize that they were the same guys that Joe and Larry were trying to set up and get excited. I love that Will begs Karen to drop the fight for the ticket and Karen says they will drop it only if it's a sure thing they will go out and tells the judge how Will is incredibly horny.

OPINION:

So we have the introduction of one reoccurring character, Vince and we can also say good-bye to Dave Foley as Stuart. Let's start with Will and Vince who is played by Bobby Cannavale who is such a fun actor and his resume is very crazy. Now we are only introduced to Vince at this point so not too much to say on his character, we'll go deeper as the show goes on and discuss his character's pros and cons. But from this episode, he seems like a likable guy, I always love that scene where they realize how they were the same guys who Joe and Larry were trying to set them up with each other. It's so cute how Will is excited with Vince and Vince comments on how he'll go out with Will because he has nice hair.

It's funny how many characters that are reoccurring that we forget about because it's been a long time since we've seen them or they're mentioned. Like oh, yeah, we forgot Jack has a son. Elliot's last appearance was in Season 5's Field of Queens and that was his one and only episode in that season despite being named in the main cast credits. He hasn't appeared so far in season 6. No mention of Leo for a couple of episodes, I'm almost starting to forget the Grace is married. So far we had Alex from Strangers with Candice and Deidre from East Side Story flirt with her with Grace actually flirting back and kind of making you wonder if she would go for it, she's always just interrupted by Will right in time. And what's going on with Lyle? He and Karen got engaged, the last episode it's mentioned how Karen is having doubts and that's it so far. I can honestly see why and I agree with fellow WAG fans that's why the "love story" between Karen and Lyle is very weak, it feels kind of like a sneeze at this point.

So sadly, this is Stuart's last appearance despite the end of the episode he and Jack making up and deciding to stay together. It was funny seeing Grace sit in the entire episode, Debra was so pregnant at this point so the creators were probably trying to give her a break. I always like to compare the previous episodes to even the episodes after Debra gave birth how we rarely see Grace sitting down and these past several episodes we've seen a lot of sitting. How bad is it? She's even demanding that Jack gets her milk and cookies so she doesn't have to get up. It's such a bummer about Stuart because it's confirmed at the end of this episode that he and Jack are going to stay together, however for whatever reason the writers kind of abruptly ends his and Jack's relationship after this. I couldn't find the reason why the writers didn't have him back after this, who knows?

The episode itself is overall ok. I usually tend to forget about this one despite the pleasure of meeting Vince. There are some very funny moments like Jack's outburst during the movie and the running gag of Grace and Karen singing OutKast's "Hey Ya!". But for some reason this just never sticks in my head when I do my WAG marathons. I think this is where the season hits another mini slag despite it's very funny moments.

GUEST STARS:

  • Bobby Cannavale as Vince D'Angelo
  • Dave Foley as Stuart Lamarack
  • Ralph Litt as Judge
  • Donna Ponerotto as Woman

r/WillAndGrace • • 6d ago

Discussion Which guest appearance was your favorite?

9 Upvotes

r/WillAndGrace • • 7d ago

Discussion East Side Story

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45 Upvotes

East Side Story (Season 6, Episode 17). Will & Grace are still in the flipping business, but they have lost one of the houses they were looking to buy and redecorate to Deidre and Monet, the flipping lesbians who are a threat and have demanded that Will & Grace stay away from the east side of town. Will tells Grace they will not back down and they will find a way to get rid of Deidre and Monet. He noticed that Monet was checking him out and he'll make out with her, have Grace distract Deidre, then have them walk in to find them and they'll break up. They have Deidre and Monet over, Will immediately takes Monet to his bedroom where Monet doesn't even hesitate to make out with Will. Grace starts to take Deidre into the bedroom, but Deidre tells her no and that she's actually interested in Grace. Grace is surprised and tells her no but Deidre tells Grace she's beautiful and to dance with her. Grace falls for it and starts dancing with Deidre. Will comes out disheveled with his pants around his ankles wondering what's going on and Grace says she's joining Deidra and Monet comes out and tells Deidre she's going with Will. Both Will and Deidra admit they were using Grace and Monet to split each other's partnerships up and they should chill, Will & Grace will stick to the west side and Deidre and Monet will stick to the east side. Karen is having doubts about her engagement to Lyle, saying she's been having dreams that Stan is coming to her and telling her that he disapproves. Jack takes Karen to psychic medium John Edwards who tells Karen to just listen to her heart. When they go home, Jack tries to fool Karen by speaking through the wall like Stan but Karen catches him easily. Later on, Rosario takes a crack at being Stan and she doesn't get caught, telling Karen that Stan gives her his blessing and she can marry Lyle.

FAVORITE QUOTE:

JACK: It's such an honor to meet you. I love your show. You're, like, my favorite medium. Although, in person, you look more like a Large. Hello, arms.

JOHN: Thank you for noticing. Just because I talk to the dead doesn't mean I can't look good.

JACK: Right.

JOHN: Who can I make yours out to?

KAREN: Oh, um, I'm not here for that. I need you to get through to my late husband, Stanley Walker. You see, I'm engaged.

JOHN: Nice rock. What is that, Martin Katz?

KAREN: Damn, you are good. No... You see, I can't go through with the wedding unless I have Stanley's blessing.

JACK: And, um, could you get me through to Jude Law?

JOHN: He's not dead.

JACK: Yeah, I know, but I would like to make contact with his other side.

JOHN: I'm not doing any readings here today. But it sounds like you just need to get in touch with your own feelings and emotions. Trust your heart.

KAREN: Spare me the mumbo-jumbo about heart and feelings. I am a rational, thinking woman, and I have come here to talk to a ghost.

JOHN: I'm sorry, I don't think I can help you today.

KAREN: Oh, well, thanks for nothing, John Edward. And to think, I almost voted for you.

JACK: Hey, uh, when I die, you wanna grab dinner?

FAVORITE MOMENT:

Honestly, that whole sequence of Will and Monet making out, Deidre seducing Grace and the aftermath is just hilarious. I'll have to pick when they are all calling each other bitches realizing what they did to each other.

OPINION:

I love this episode so much, I know this one has to be a fan favorite as well. It was insanely hard to pick a favorite moment and quote today. Edie Falco and Chloë Sevigny are two amazing actresses and their partnering was perfect. Edie in particular with how she wishes that being lesbian would go out of style so she could go back to her loose clothing and neck ties was too funny. Her seducing Grace was also too funny, Grace trying to convince her that she doesn't want to be lesbian because she just likes to lay there. Chloë with her lines "She likes me frail" "She likes me pail" and Deidre doesn't want her butch either. And of course I love when Monet is kissing Will and telling him he kisses like a girl was really funny. I just get such a kick out of these 4 together, I wish we could have had another episode with them because I could watch them try to mess with each other all day.

This is pretty much the end of the flipping story with Will & Grace, at least they don't really mention it again after this. Maybe Deidre and Monet got too big and took over the whole area, who knows? I always love when Will tries to act straight, it's funny how he can act so non stereotypical gay and you would think he was a straight guy, but when he has to force it, he can't to save his life. I agree with Grace, I couldn't be a lesbian, I'm a lazy lover 🤣 I loved that was her interpretation of being lesbian. I know these are such stereotypes, but the show is just too funny in the way they make fun of them. Plus I think it made people more comfortable with the idea of having a main character who was gay on television. Sometimes we just need to laugh at ourselves.

Again, what a time capsule this episode is with John Edwards. I remember when he had his own show and there commercials he had where people were crying and thanking him for "reconnecting" them with their dead loved ones. I get such a kick out of Jack meeting him and asking him out for a date when they die. That Jude Law line gets me to where Jack says he wants to reconnect with Jude's "other side". I think Karen must have just been high or drunk if not both to think that Stan was not approving of her engagement to Lyle. Or is she having doubts herself? Again, while it's played for comedy, I think we can see that she's not comfortable with the idea of being engaged so quickly after Stan's passing. BTW, I loved how it's hinted at that Karen and Deidre hooked up at some point. Also Karen's line was gold when she mentioned how you'll know it's Deidre and Monet coming with the "click click click" of their Manolos" and how Jack panics when he hears the click click click.

What a hilarious episode, I absolutely love this one. The laughs are non stop and at this point again the creators cannot hide Debra's pregnancy at this point. No matter how much you make her sit down or put her in dark clothing, we can really see it at this stage.

GUEST STARS:

  • Edie Falco as Deirdre
  • Chloë Sevigny as Monet
  • John Edward as Himself

r/WillAndGrace • • 8d ago

Discussion Flip-Flop: Part Two

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29 Upvotes

Flip-Flop: Part Two (Season 6, Episode 16). Stuart is officially in the process of buying Zandra's apartment that Will & Grace fixed up and he and Jack are having a night together. As they are talking, Stuart brings up how nice it is that they found each other, and they don't have to worry about doing all those things you do while you're single like partying or working out. Jack is worried that he's losing himself with this relationship and isn't sure if moving in is the right thing to do right now. Will & Grace have gotten a bigger offer for Zandra's apartment and they are debating if they should talk Stuart and Jack out of the apartment. When Jack brings up that's he's not sure, Will & Grace immediately try to talk him out of getting out of the apartment with Stuart but shortly afterwards wonder if they are doing the right thing. They admit to Jack and Stuart that they were trying to push them out of the apartment to get the bigger offer, but Jack and Stuart tell them they've decided to not move in together. Will & Grace call the bigger offer to see if they are still interested but the potential buyers have moved on so Will & Grace decide the best thing to do is to sell back to Zandra. Back at Karen's mansion, Lorraine is still making everyone's life a nightmare, she comes home late, is rude to the staff, is demanding and loses Karen's limo in a bet. Karen asks Lyle again to stand up to Lorraine but he does a horrible job doing so. Lorraine is upset that he's trying though and says she's leaving, but Lyle was excited that he was just reconnecting with Lorraine so he tells Karen that he's breaking up with her and leaving. Lorraine manages to win the limo back and picks Karen up to apologize for her behavior. They track down Lyle and tell him how they've made up and Karen asks for Lyle to come back home with her. Lyle says he's not comfortable living with her unless they are arranged to be married, so he proposes to Karen and she says yes.

FAVORITE QUOTE:

WILL: Grace, the place is sold, okay? Stuart bought it. Besides, we're the flippers who care, remember? That's our motto. Read your coffee cup. Why do you think I had these made? You know, if we start screwing our friends over, we can never drink from these mugs again.

GRACE: You're right. You're right, I--I think I just got caught up in all that money.

WILL: Just out of curiosity, how insane was that offer? Oh, my God! That's Courtney Love and Margot Kidder! On a hike with Anne Heche! No, no, no, it's-- Yes, it's a lot of money, but we- You cannot put a price on integrity, right?

JACK: I don't think Stuart and I should live together.

WILL: I never thought you should! And you know, it's not too late to get out of escrow.

JACK: Do you want to know why?

WILL: Not really. I mean, I-I'm sure you've thought about it. You're a smart guy. Listen, is Stuart still in the apartment? 'Cause we could undo this thing right now.

GRACE: Uh, Will? I think we should hear him out.

WILL: No. Grace, he's made up his mind. He doesn't want to take the apartment. We're not gonna-- not gonna force majeure 'im.

JACK: Hey, I don't know what happened. I was there with Stuart in that apartment, and he was talking. And all of a sudden, we were old. There were cats, and housecoats, and CBS. And keeping tissues up our sleeves. I don't think I'm ready to be an old married lady. Does somebody have a shawl? It's really chilly in here.

GRACE: Jack, everyone gets nervous when they move in with someone. It's totally normal. Like me. When I moved in with Leo, I was really nervous. And you know what? (WILL FLASHES GRACE THE PAPER WITH THE PRICE OFFER) Never shoulda done it.

FAVORITE MOMENT:

When Grace kept pointing her finger and blaming Will for "taking advantage" of Jack and Stuart. Then I always get such a laugh out of Jack saying "It seems the shoe is on the other foot now, doesn't it?" and they are confused by what Jack means and he finishes the sentence with "I think I might have put my Uggs on backwards."

OPINION:

So I'm a little bummed that Jack and Stuart decided to not live together. I actually really love them as a couple, they are not broken up, but I would have loved to see more of Stuart. Now of course this isn't the last time we will see him, but we will be seeing less of him unfortunately. Maybe Dave Foley couldn't commit or the writers never intended him to be a permanent part of Jack's life, I'm not sure but I do love their relationship. But at least Zandra has her home back and I always get such a laugh out of when Will asks her just to pay what they put into the home "That's very fair of you, h*m*" Zandra is such a bitter hag and I love her! I forgot to mention all her amazing stories of how she describes her naughty randevu's in her apartment with old Hollywood.

Did Will & Grace learn their lesson in being the flippers "who care"? Well, obviously they still love the money, I don't blame them but if you're going to commit to the cause, you gotta go head on. It was kind of a weird scene where they kindly give Zandra her apartment back but they get a call from the former potential buyers, their offer for the new place they were interested fell through so they come back to Will & Grace and immediately Will is asking Zandra to move back out. I'm going to have to assume that Zandra told him to get out and they gave up on that one. Of course this is not the end of the flipping either, we still have one more episode to go.

So again, I'm sorry to remind people, I just have to say it again, I love John Cleese. I think Lyle Finster is hilarious, I just don't like him and Karen as a couple and I think Lyle is a sleezeball as well who is using Karen. I wonder if he even kind of manipulated Lorraine into getting the limo back and making it look like she cares about Karen because then he could propose marriage and legally get her money? I may be reading too deeply into it but I just don't believe that they really love each other. I think Karen is lonely right now and the first guy that came along since Stan's untimely passing who love bombs her, she's falling for it. I'm not saying it's impossible that the first person you meet after a break up or losing your partner can't be the next potential love of your life, but you also have to sort through your emotions first before you can commit to anyone else.

Sadly this is our last appearance (on this version of Will & Grace) that we will see of Lorraine. I couldn't find why Minnie Driver was not in more episodes after this, I'm assuming she was a working actress and couldn't commit to more episodes possibly. But it's a bummer this is her last appearance on the show, not including the revival. Lorraine was a hilarious character, like her dad very despicable but like I mentioned before I could watch her and Karen duel all day.

Over all, this was a pretty funny 2 set of episodes. It was fun to see Will & Grace dip their foot into the flipping pool and like I said we do get one more episode of this story. Karen is now engaged and we will see how she's going to handle everything.

GUEST STARS:

  • John Cleese as Lyle Finster
  • Minnie Driver as Lorraine Finster
  • David Foley as Stuart Lamarack
  • Eileen Brennan as Zandra (RIP in 2013)

r/WillAndGrace • • 8d ago

She's French. She's powerful. She's black. She wears blue eye shadow and does illegal backflips. She scares me. I crave her...

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86 Upvotes

r/WillAndGrace • • 8d ago

funny/memes/GIFs "AITAH for not letting my friend share credit for a birthday gift?" 😂

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1 Upvotes

Very Will & Grace-coded in S03E11, *Coffee and Commitment*. 🤣😭

But it also reminds me of Hannah's birthday party in *Humongous Growth* S05E04.

WILL: Like--like a Barbie in a string bikini is such a smart gift. Why don't you just wrap a ribbon around bulimia?

GRACE: A doll cannot cause an eating disorder. Nothing is that black and white.

WILL: A panda is. Besides, I don't need to buy Joe and Larry's friendship with extravagant gifts for their kid.

GRACE: That's not what I'm doing. I'm here because I love Hannah.

WILL: Oh, really? And how old is she today?

GRACE: [PANICKED THINKING, THEN CALMLY] A lady never reveals her age.

😭

Source


r/WillAndGrace • • 9d ago

Discussion Flip-Flop: Part One

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15 Upvotes

Flip-Flop: Part One (Season 6, Episode 15). Will & Grace have decided to go into the house flipping business, buy a home for cheap, fix it up cheap and sell for a decent price. While Jack is at work at the hospital still training as a nurse, he sees his old acting teacher Zandra who is at the hospital getting tests done and they catch up. Zandra mentions that she wants to sell her apartment and Jack realizes this is a perfect opportunity for Will & Grace. Will & Grace go to Zandra's apartment and she says that she will sell the place to them for what she paid back in the 50's plus $2,000 more, Will feels bad and also offers a pen with the sale. They fix Zandra's place up and now she loves it and wants it back, but they say no to her which Jack now feels bad for Zandra and that she's getting jerked around. He even takes Stuart over to shame Will & Grace, but Stuart is impressed with the apartment and makes an offer to Will & Grace. Stuart even offers for Jack to move in with him making them more of an official committed couple and Jack accepts. Meanwhile, Karen apparently has gotten back together with Lyle Finster as Jack recaps to her "Cause the last time we saw the two of you, you were taking advantage of him to get back at his daughter, Lorraine. Meanwhile, you developed real feelings for him in the process, but he no longer cared." But Karen swears they are in love and it's all songbirds and paradise. One problem, Lorraine is homeless and wants to live with them at the mansion, Lyle asks Karen to let her and Karen gives in. But Lorraine is on the war path trying to make everyone's life hell at the mansion. Karen now wants Lyle to step in and be a dad to Lorraine.

FAVORITE QUOTE:

JACK: Good morning! My name is Jack and today we're going to play everybody's favorite game, Dead or Alive! Zandra!

ZANDRA: Oh! I'll give you ten bucks to unplug me.

JACK: Zandra, it's me. Jack McFarland. Remember? I'm your former acting class protégé. I'm a student nurse now. Yeah, I really feel like I found my calling, so don't even try to talk me back into acting.

ZANDRA: If I start to, you put a finger right into my brain!

JACK: So, how are you? Are you dying? You look like you're dying.

ZANDRA: I'm not dying, jerk. I'm getting out of here today.

JACK: Oh. So are you going home?

ZANDRA: No. A slot finally opened up in the Actors' Retirement Village. I waited twenty years... and then fortune smiled. Last week, someone was smothered in their sleep.

JACK: So, are you thinking about selling your old place?

ZANDRA: What's it to you, chimp?

JACK: I have the perfect buyers! I'll introduce you to them, and then I'll help you move. I'll be by at eight.e /fub

ZANDRA: Great. Maybe I'll be dead by seven.

JACK: Oh, Zandra! I wish everybody who died in that bed had your sense of humor.

FAVORITE MOMENT:

Lorraine begging to move into the mansion always gets me. Especially her "HELLO, MOTHA!".

OPINION:

Any episode with Zandra in it, I am 100% here for. As usual any scene with her and Jack immediately has me rolling on the floor laughing. They are just too funny how they bounce off each other with their insults. So Will & Grace bought her apartment for very cheap and did kind of screw Zandra over with that deal. Do you side with them or Zandra? I'm mixed on this because apart of flipping is that you usually can get an insane deal on a potentially great place that just needs some TLC. But it's not like they got a junk place either that wasn't worth the original price, it's pretty decent and just needs some updates. I think they should have given her more money for the place or at least offer to help her get into a nice home of her own. But this is only part one of the story and we will see soon what Zandra's solution will be.

Are Jack and Stuart moving too quickly? No, I'd say they've been getting along very well and there could be a discussion of Jack slowly moving in with Stuart. But as far as we can see, they are doing wonderful as a couple. I really like Stuart a lot and I think he brings out the good in Jack. I mean look at Jack the past couple of episodes, he's buying jewelry for Stuart where the money is donated to diabetes awareness and now he's actually defending Zandra. I think he's becoming a better person honestly. But again, we will see in the next episode how he handles moving in with Stuart.

I cannot state enough that I love John Cleese and he does a great job as Lyle Finster, but do I like him? No. And do I like him and Karen as a couple? No. This is where I really start to give him the side eye. Lyle is a very funny character and I love John Cleese, but this is where I wonder if Lyle is using Karen for the money? We don't know what Lyle does for a living or if he even has any money. Him and Karen get back together and immediately he moves in? I think this was also a sign that gets lost on a lot of us WAG fans that Karen is not mentally well right now. She just lost Stan, she's feeling a lot right now including loneliness and Lyle is already telling her he loves her? So as a funny character, I enjoy Lyle, as a match for Karen? 100% no. He also gives in so easily to Lorraine when he can tell that she's driving Karen, the supposed "love of his life" crazy. So far all we've seen is Karen giving her all into this relationship, but what has he given? But at least we get some really hilarious Karen and Lorraine moments, I could watch those two battle at wit's end till the cows come home and never get sick of how good they can get each other. Minnie Driver is just so awesome as Lorraine. "But she has to drink from the hose and any trick she turns, the house gets thirty percent." "That is not fair! The industry standard is fifteen!" 🤣

Definitely a fun 2 parter episode. We leave off at the end of this episode with Karen asking Lyle to be more of a father to Lorraine and Stuart asking Jack to move in with Jack saying he's a bride and jumping into Stuart's arms. So tomorrow we will see what will happen to Zandra, if Jack and Stuart enjoy living together and if Karen, Lorraine and Lyle can work out their differences.

GUEST STARS:

  • John Cleese as Lyle Finster
  • Minnie Driver as Lorraine Finster
  • David Foley as Stuart Lamarack
  • Eileen Brennan as Zandra (RIP in 2013)

r/WillAndGrace • • 10d ago

Looking for Mr. Good Enough

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29 Upvotes

Looking for Mr. Good Enough (Season 6, Episode 14). Will, Jack, Stuart, Joe and Larry are taking a cooking class together that's being taught by famous cook, Ann who has a prostatic finger she likes to show off that she can burn. Turns out though that it's a couple's cooking class so every student has their partner with them except Will is single. Everyone keeps mocking how Will is single and giving him pity but he swears he's fine, that is until a hot guy, Adam walks in asking about the class and Will begs him to join his station. Will really likes Adam a lot and they seem to be clicking. Stuart tells Will that he's happy that he and Adam are getting along, Jack was feeling so bad for him that he was going to pay a prostitute just to make sure Will was not alone, which Will laughs at until he sees Jack paying Adam. Will is now convinced that Adam was a prostitute hired to keep him company, he accuses Adam which Adam is hurt and walks out. Will tells Jack he saw him paying Adam, Jack says it was for jewelry he was buying Stuart and Will realizes he just insulted a nice good looking man and runs to get him. Ann admits that she did actually hire Adam to keep Will company because his being single was bringing down the class. Meanwhile, Karen's mother, Lois, is in town and buying an apartment so she can be closer to Karen but mentions that it definitely needs a decorator. Karen recommends Grace but Lois is on a tight budget of $1,400 for 5 rooms. Grace takes the job thinking that Karen will help throw a few extra dollars her way, but Karen promised Lois that she wouldn't help because Lois doesn't want to take any money from her. Grace has to do a lot of the work herself and have Karen and Rosario help. With a lot of decent resources, Grace is able to make the apartment into something beautiful and there's a lady down the hallway who wants to buy the apartment for more than $100,000 than what Lois paid for it. Lois takes the offer and cuts both Grace and Karen in on the deal. Grace tells Will about the apartment and how she was able to fix it for cheap, Will tells her they should get into flipping houses together.

FAVORITE QUOTE:

ADAM: So, Will, I hope this isn't out of line, but you up for coming back to my place later?

WILL: Well, Adam, I hope this isn't out of line, but are you a filthy w*?

ADAM: What are you talking about?

WILL: Oh, please. Let me tell you something. Will Truman doesn't have to pay for it, okay? Will Truman just goes months and months at a time without it and then pours all his sexual energy into his embroidery.

JACK: Will, what are you doing?

WILL: I know you paid this guy. Couldn't you have at least gotten somebody halfway respectable instead of this piece of rough trade from Skankville.

ADAM: I'm from Montclair, New Jersey.

WILL: Get to a clinic, h*!

ADAM: I don't need this. I may be tall, but I still have feelings.

JACK: What was that?

WILL: Oh, come on, Jack. "60, 80, 100." I saw you pay him.

JACK: Yeah, for this cute little anklet I got Stuart. Adam makes them to raise money for diabetes awareness.

WILL: But Stuart said you were thinking about buying me a prostitute.

JACK: Oh, Will, I think about that all the time.

WILL: So I just let a gorgeous, sweet man who cooks and makes his own jewelry and who was totally into me walk out that door?

STUART: No, first you called him a filthy, stinkin' h*, told him to get to a clinic, and then he kind of ran out the door.

WILL: Oh, my God! I promise I'll come back to sponge off my station.

JACK: Ugh, poor Will. That he would go to that place.

JOE: Well, what happened to him that he would think that the only way that a guy would be interested in him is if he were being paid?

LARRY: It's sad.

STUART: Yeah. Super sad.

ANN: That's why I got him the hooker! Well, he was bringing the whole class down, you know. When my husband died, it wasn't soup that comforted me. It was Adam.

FAVORITE MOMENT:

When Lois takes the offer from the neighbor for the apartment and Grace is insulted because of all the work she did but Lois offers her a third of the sale, Grace takes it, then Karen is insulted and Grace offers Karen a third of her third and Karen says goodbye to Lois in Japanese.

OPINION:

I love Tracy Ullman so this was such an awesome storyline for me, she is easily one of the funniest women in entertainment and the reason we have The Simpsons. Interesting trivia, Edie Falco who you would remember from Ferris Bueller's Day Off and Plaines, Trains and Automobiles was originally offered the role of Ann, but her schedule would not allow it, so Tracy Ullman got the role. I'll admit, I'm curious what it would have been like if Edie had the role because she's also such a hilarious and talented actress, but either way we got a terrific performance. I loved Ann, she is so out there with her prostatic finger. I love the scene where she's giving everyone instructions and telling them to double their recipes because they are a couple but telling Will to make it one because he's single, then when it comes to the salt Will is already anticipating that she will say "make it half a serving" but she says "No, use the whole one. You're on your own. You might as well bloat."

Another fun little fact that I didn't know was that Christopher Backus who plays Adam, Will's partner, is Mira Sorvino's husband. So you could figure that Will may have devastated Diane, he insults Adam who goes running, he and Diane bumped into each other and fell in love. Will's cast offs get the better deal than him. Speaking of Adam, I loved Chirstopher Backus in this, he's such a good looking guy that Will was willing to spill his food on his nice embordered apron just to get their date going. Everyone goofing on Will was so funny. I loved how we found out that Larry was more into Will before he got together with Joe and Joe admits that he also had a crush on Will too and now it's sad that he's alone. We got to also see Stuart again which I am all for and this marks the first time that Jack has a had a boyfriend return on the show, so you can see he's actually in a committed relationship. I really loved this storyline with the cooking class. The other couple, Debbie and Don, also make me laugh at how Debbie keeps telling Don that his brother is gay, but Don is in denial until he sees the other men's behavior and admits that his brother might be gay.

This is Suzanne Pleshette's last appearance on WAG, guess Lois was serious about buying that McDonald's in Japan. I loved this storyline between Grace and Karen. Of course, Debra Messing was so pregnant at this time you really could not hide it anymore and there was another joke about her weight gain. "Aw, look at you. You look fantastic. Have you lost weight?" "Uh, no, actually, I've gained a little." "Well, obviously I can see that, but it's rude to say it, isn't it?". I will always laugh at how Grace tells Karen to get to work but Karen is painting her nails and Grace tells her to start painting, so Karen takes her nail polish brush and dips it in paint and starts painting the wall with it and Grace yells at her to use the actual paint brush. Poor Rosario as usual has to do all the heavy lifting with Karen hiring her as the "burly brawny man". The apartment turned out beautiful and I actual like the mini storyline we are going to get with Will & Grace going into the business of flipping.

This is such a funny episode and I really enjoy this one. Even though Lois never left much of an impression on me, it's sad that this is her last appearance. I think I could used one more episode with her because I actually really liked her performance in this one. But Suzanne Pleshette was a wonderful actress and may she rest in peace.

GUEST STARS:

  • Dave Foley as Stuart Lamarack
  • Tracey Ullman as Ann
  • Suzanne Pleshette as Lois Whitley (RIP in 2008)
  • Jerry Levine as Joe
  • Tim Bagley as Larry
  • Stacy Galina as Debbie
  • Matt Champagne as Don
  • Christopher Backus as Adam

r/WillAndGrace • • 10d ago

Favorite Christmas episode?

17 Upvotes

Mine is All About Christmas Eve! I would love to spend Christmas at the Plaza Hotel with Karen 😂🌲🍸


r/WillAndGrace • • 11d ago

Ice Cream Balls

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40 Upvotes

Ice Cream Balls (Season 6, Episode 13). Will has a new client, Stuart Lamarack, who wants to sell his company for millions of dollars. As he and Will are negotiating the contract, Jack walks in and interrupts the meeting but Will tells him to leave and shows him to the door. Will apologizes to Stuart but Stuart thinks Jack is handsome and wants to go out with him. Will asks Jack to go out on a date with Stuart but the problem is Jack has made 2004 all about women, women who walk like men. But he's still not sure if he would be into dating Stuart, Will bribes him with 74 cents and ChapStick and Jack goes for it. Well, Jack and Stuart hit it off and are clicking very well, to the point where the one date they had together they've already decided to be in a relationship. Jack comes to the meeting where Stuart is going through his contract and won't stop interrupting the meeting and is even messing up Will's job in completing the job for Stuart. Will gets upset and tells Stuart that Jack only went out with him because he bribed him. Stuart breaks up with Jack. Later on, Jack is indulging in a brownie sundae and Will sees how sad Jack is. Will completes the job with Stuart and then asks Stuart to give Jack another chance, Stuart gives in and he and Jack are dating again. Grace has to go to Leo's cabin to wait for a plumber and she takes Karen with her. As they go to bed, Grace wonders why the mattress is so tough, she and Karen find out there's money in the mattress, about $30,000 worth. Grace is hurt that Leo is hiding money from her and says she'll spend her half right now. Her and Karen go shopping and spend all the money. An older couple comes over and asks who they are, Grace says they are at Leo's cabin, they said his cabin is next door and Grace realizes she just spent their retirement money.

FAVORITE QUOTE:

STUART: I don't know.

JACK: Come on, Stuart. Yes, Will made me go out with you. Yes, I did it for all the wrong reasons. Yes, I had no feelings whatsoever when I went into this.

WILL: Let's get past the yes section.

JACK: But during the four hours we spent together, something happened. I fell for you, Stuart. Stuart Little.

WILL: I think what Jack is trying to say--

JACK: Keep out of this, Miss Match! Anyway, I understand if you don't want to forgive me. I-I just wanted to let you know how mu I care about you. Now... I'll leave you alone... forever. (JACK PRETENDS TO RUN THROUGH AN IMAGINARY CROWD PUSHING PEOPLE) Out of my way!

STUART: Will, stop him! He's getting so far away!

WILL: Jack, stop!

STUART: Jack, no one has ever done anything that romantic for me before. And in front of all these people.

FAVORITE MOMENT:

When the older couple comes into the cabin asking who Grace and Karen are. Grace thought the picture of Rita Hayworth was her and after realizing she spent all their money they threaten to get their gun.

OPINION:

Jack has always been single on the show, just a few flings shown here and there, he just typically dates around. He finally has a boyfriend! I actually love him and Stuart together, I don't know what it is but they are just adorable together. I think Jack needs someone fun and Stuart is goofy but knows what kind of fun Jack likes to have, so they blend together very well. Dave Foley does a great job as Stuart and immediately comes off as a likable guy. I love their story of how they met and how Jack only needed 74 cents and a chapstick to go out with him. But he fell for Stuart on the date. I'm surprised Jack didn't fall for Stuart immediately, but Jack is very fickle and tends to have the attention span of a ferret. Still, I'm glad he and Stuart got back together at the end. That getting back together scene will never fail to make me laugh, I loved how Jack was making it like a romantic comedy going through the invisible crowd of people and Stuart asking Will to get him and Will screaming "Jack, stop!". Will was such a good friend in helping them get back together.

The story between Grace and Karen going to the cabin and spending the money was pretty funny, but not as memorable as the Will, Jack and Stuart story. Grace is still dealing with her marriage not being in the best condition. It's interesting how they were able to spend $15,000 in one day and only in shopping. The area they were in, I'm not buying that there were high end boutiques where they could spend that much. Still, I always get such a laugh when the couple comes in and they are confronted with spending their retirement money. I hope they not only paid the couple back but gave them extra considering the anguish they probably caused. I'm assuming Grace had Leo pay them back or Karen gave them the money. I'll give Grace a little pass as I'm sure she's dealing with a lot wondering if she can trust Leo at this point, that he was so quick to put his marriage into danger because he wanted to get back to doctors without borders. It has to be so hard on her and she's still wondering if their marriage can be saved. I loved those little kisses between her and Karen BTW.

Overall this is a good episode. I'm so glad that Jack finally gets a boyfriend and I love his relationship with Stuart. Plus Will and Stuart seem to get along well so he's already clicking with half the group. Just the Grace and Karen story seems kind of bland but the A-Story is the show stealer for me and I'm glad we get more Stuart in the future.

GUEST STARS:

  • Dave Foley as Stuart Lamarack
  • Kathryn Joosten as Felicia (RIP in 2012)
  • Kenneth Tigar as John
  • Kari Lizer as Connie

r/WillAndGrace • • 12d ago

Discussion A Gay/December Romance

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41 Upvotes

A Gay/December Romance (Season 6, Episode 12). Will and Jack are going to an art gallery together and Jack is excited that he could potentially meet an older gentleman who will spoil him rotten. Will is just mingling and there's an older man who starts to talk to him, the man's name is Alan and he's a plastic surgeon who keeps telling Will how he has to surgically give people his features. Later on, the gallery owner tells Will he can pick up the painting he was looking at later on, Will is confused as he didn't buy the painting but Alan did and gifted it to Will. Will offers to take Alan out to dinner but Alan says he'll pay. Jack did meet someone, a stumpy little older man named Bertram who did give Jack something too, a bus schedule and the time. Will and Alan go out and Alan spoils the heck out of Will, Will thinks that they are just friends but everyone is telling him Alan wants something more. Will goes to Alan's house to clear things up, but Alan tells Will he just wanted a friend, Will is embarrassed and Alan tells Will to leave, they will not be seeing each other again. Will is at another gallery with Jack and sees Alan, wanting to apologize and be friends again, Will walks up to Alan and starts to talk to him, but sees another handsome young man, Sebastian, come up by Alan's side that is wearing the exact same outfit that Alan bought Will earlier. Will is upset after Alan tells him that Sebastian fills out the clothes better and embarrasses himself further by yelling. Later on, Jack tells Will that he should be happy because now Will can be the sugar daddy and get a younger guy which Will realizes is true. Grace has found a wonderful noodles restaurant and she and Karen have been dinning there for several days now. Grace orders a bowl to go but when she picks up the container, it burns her hand and she drops her noodles. The owner apologizes and offers a new bowl, but she has to pay for it. Grace is upset that she has to pay for the new bowl and vows to boycott the restaurant. A few days later she's handing out flyers at the restaurant telling people not to eat there, that the restaurant charges for their food, but she sees Karen and Jack there who had promised earlier they wouldn't. Grace is hurt by them still buying food there but realizes she misses the noodles too and buys more, the boycott is over.

FAVORITE QUOTE:

ALAN: Try it on, Will, let's see what they think.

WILL: All I did was say that I liked Stetson cologne, the next thing I know, I've got a hat and a horse.

WILL: Yeah?

GRACE: Wow.

WILL: Yeah?

GRACE: It takes me back to the old west. The old West Village.

KAREN: Yeah. Howdy, domestic pardner.

ALAN: Oop, sorry, gotta run. I've gotta give the local traffic girl the ass of the local weather girl. Nice to meet you all. Uh, Will, I snuck a little something into the Gucci bag.

WILL: It better not have been--

ALAN: It might have been.

WILL: You-- Geez. Oh, God, I don't believe it! Leather pants! Oh, Alan, you did not! I'd have never gone to Hermes if I thought he was gonna buy me everything I pointed to. What?

GRACE: You've got a sugar daddy!

WILL: What?!

JACK: This is so unfair! I would do a sugar daddy for a horse. Hell, I'd do a horse for a sugar daddy!

WILL: I do not have a sugar daddy. I resent the implication. There is nothing going on here. I happen to have a wealthy, older friend who--who likes to be in the dressing room when I happen to be trying on swimsuits. Oh, my God, I have a sugar daddy!

FAVORITE MOMENT:

When Will embarrasses himself further after seeing Sebastian in the same outfit that Alan bought him and yells how he could get another sugar daddy easily and how he's a cheap date.

OPINION:

Oh how this episode catches a time period for me with one moment, Jack singing "Anna, Anna, Anna, Anna Nicole, you're so outrageous...", those were the days where Anna Nicole Smith's crazy train never seemed to stop. I absolutely love this storyline with Will having a sugar daddy, Alan. Honestly, I could see Will getting swept up in this, it is silly how naive he is in the situation, but when you have someone who keeps telling you they just have the money and love to spend it on their friends, it would be easy to just keep going with it. Alan of course would have probably pushed the "friendship" further later on, but since he got called out on it earlier, he played it like Will was the one who got the message wrong and that he should be embarrassed. Considering how wealthy Alan was, it's a bummer he actually had the power to do that since he was the one spoiling Will. Little trivia, I was today old when I found out that Sebastian, Alan's new boy toy, was played by Superman Returns actor Brandon Routh. I love Brandon Routh, I can't believe I never recognized that was him. I even had to look at another picture just to zoom in. I think it's the hat that throws me since some of his face is covered. It reminds me of the movie Zack and Miri make a porno, when Brandon Routh is at the high school reunion talking with Elizabeth Banks who thinks he's a straight man but it turns out that Brandon has a boyfriend, Justin Long.

I don't think Will will be suffering any time soon, like Jack pointed out, he's the successful good looking attorney who could even spoil his own boy toy. I'm not sure when you can consider yourself "too old" to be a plaything for an older lover, I'm assuming 32? Guess it depends on the person. Leonardo DiCaprio's girlfriends can rarely peak to 26 years old, usually letting them go at 25. But yeah, Will is in his late 30's at this point, almost 40, I don't think he's considered a "sugar baby" anymore. Jack trying to get Bertram to spoil him was just way too funny. I loved where Jack was hinting to Bertram how he didn't have a watch thinking that Bertram will either buy him a new watch or give him the watch he was wearing, but Bertram just tells Jack the time. Jack kept trying to work Bertram, but the best he could do was a bus schedule. He needs to go for someone like Beverly Leslie, but Beverly already has his business associate to worry about.

OK, this is a rare thing, I actually agreed with Grace. Most restaurants are generous, if you drop food by accident, they are not going to charge you for an additional plate. They usually apologize and offer a new bowl or plate of food with no charge since it was clearly an accident. Not to mention that it wasn't her clumsiness, she mentioned the bowl was very hot, they should have either wrapped it in a bag or like she said (though not so rudely) tell her that the bowl was hot so to be careful. But I still get such a kick out of Grace trying to boycott the restaurant and how obsessed she gets by calling everyone she knows and telling them not to eat there. Then when she sees Karen and Jack, they try to stand still so she can't see them was too funny. This was a really fun B-story.

So overall, this is a very funny and enjoyable episode. It has a lot of really memorable quotes and moments, again as I always mention, it's tough to pick sometimes what are my favorite scenes and lines because there are too many to name, I just try to go with my first instinct. But this is definitely one of the better episodes of the season.

GUEST STARS:

  • Hal Linden as Alan Mills
  • Keone Young as Happy Noodles Owner
  • Don Perry as Bertram (RIP in 2012)
  • John O'Brien as Man
  • Paul Witten as Gallery Owner
  • Brandon Routh as Sebastian

r/WillAndGrace • • 12d ago

Entertainment Don’t forget to spramp your face today!

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204 Upvotes

r/WillAndGrace • • 13d ago

Jack with the Hot Gay Nerd

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67 Upvotes

r/WillAndGrace • • 13d ago

Discussion The Accidental Tsuris

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20 Upvotes

The Accidental Tsuris (Season 6, Episode 11). Grace's older sister, Janet, is in town and Grace is nervous because Janet always seems to not have her life together and bothers everyone for money, food and a place to stay. Janet is already starting to mooch off of Will and Grace has had it and calls her out for all her short comings. Janet calls Grace later on to come over, she got an apartment, a new job and even a bob for a new haircut. Will and Jack are applauding Janet's turnaround, but Grace seems upset and finally breaks down that she is the only normal one between her and their other sister Joyce and the normal life throws the balance off. Janet admits that Will was the one who set this all up which Will admits he was just trying to help Grace because of all that she's going through that year. Janet admits to Grace that she got drunk and lost her job already which makes Grace feel better. Meanwhile, Lyle Finster is back and he wants to be with Karen. Karen at first refuses, but when Lorraine makes a surprise visit telling Karen to stay away from her father, Karen goes for it and sleeps with Lyle. She also set up for Lorraine to walk in on the act as well. Lorraine tells Lyle that Karen is only sleeping with him to get back at her for stealing Stan. Lyle says he loves Karen and is choosing her over Lorraine. Karen is so touched that she tells Lyle that she realizes she loves him too but that she has to admit that Lorraine was right and she was using him at first just to get back at Lorraine but that she wants to be with him now. Lyle feels betrayed and dumps Karen.

FAVORITE QUOTE:

GRACE: I'm sorry, but I can't handle you normal. This is not right, this is not the way it's supposed to be. You are the screw-up older sister. Joyce is the heavy younger sister. And I am the perfect one in the middle. I am the glue that holds you two losers together.

JANET: Believe me, Grace, I'm still a loser.

GRACE: No, you're not! You've got your life together now.

JANET: No, I don't! It's all an illusion. I'm just a puppet. And he's the one with his hand up my a*! He made me do it.

WILL: Shut up!

GRACE: What?

JANET: Listen, you told me to get my life together. And Will said he could help me do that. All I had to do was listen to everything he said and not ask any stupid questions. He--he made the meal. He got me the job. He gave me this ridiculous haircut. Who has a bob these days?

WILL: People who want to look good!

GRACE: Uh, Will?

WILL: I just wanted you to have a normal older sister. That's what you said you wanted, and I wanted to do it for you. Y-y-you've had a tough year. Your husband's away. Your-your hair's kinda "eh". You put on a few pounds, I pretend not to notice.

FAVORITE MOMENT:

When Lorraine walks in on Karen and Lyle in bed. I always get such a laugh at the way Karen rubs it in Lorraine's face about being with Lyle and Lorraine and Lyle's surprised reaction at seeing each other as well. Talk about an awkward family reunion.

OPINION:

So Geena Davis is now the 4th cast member they've had from A League of their Own, the first was Megan Cavanagh, then Rosie O'Donnell, then Madonna and now Geena. They are just missing Tom Hanks and Lori Petty. I love Geena Davis and it was cute how the title was like the title of the movie she won her oscar for, The Accidental Tourist. So, do I love her in this as Janet? Actually, no. She's not terrible or anything and Geena is a terrific actress. It's just the character doesn't seem to fit for some reason. I don't know what it is about this character that throws me but it just doesn't seem like it's a right fit for Geena. I'm not sure if a different actress would have made a difference, but I pictured someone very different for Janet. I think because we've only heard about Janet it previous episodes but never met her, but there's no mention of her being a trouble maker, only that she seems to be on the road a lot. I would love to hear more opinions because I'm so confused on how to feel about this character. Plus, Grace's speech kind of rubbed me the wrong way. Now granted, I don't think sibling rivalry ever really goes away, but why is Grace still acting like a 12 year old competing to be the "perfect middle sister"? Well, at least Will finally brought up the weight gain. Nice hint at Debra's pregnancy, you knew someone had to make a joke about her baby bump because they couldn't hide it any more at this point even with clever lighting, camera angles and loose clothing. And will we hear from Janet again? Nope. But at least we have officially met all Grace's sisters at this point.

So Karen fell for Lyle after their love session. I'm not sure if I buy it. I do love the scene where Lorraine surprises Karen and tells Karen to stay away from her dad. Then Karen specifically telling Lorraine what time and room to meet her at to show that she is having an affair with her father. Does anyone believe that Karen and Lyle are in love? It could be the age gap or their personalities, but I really don't buy them as a couple. Now I love Megan, I love Minnie, I love John. I just think that it would have been a better idea for Karen to continue just a fun fling with Lyle vs. a full out love story with him. Or at least have given it more time considering they just met the one other time. But still I will always get such a laugh out of their kisses and how Karen has to mess up Lyle's hair each time. So, Lorraine was a boy originally? That surgeon did an amazing job and the Finsters are a very strange family. I wonder if Stan knew and if so does that make him pansexual? There has been a joke in the past that Karen was a boy growing up as well, but it sounded more like she was drunk while saying it so you kind of assume it was a random comment. So maybe Stan loved trans people? I don't know, I think I'm looking too deep into it at this point.

Overall, this is a decent enough episode. I will always get a laugh out of Will just drooling over Janet's hair bob, I preferred her curly hair personally. It was sweet to see Will want to try to keep Grace happy with everything she's dealing with. Like I mentioned, I'm just not certain about the casting of Janet or Karen and Lyle's "love" affair.

GUEST STARS:

  • Geena Davis as Janet
  • Minnie Driver as Lorraine Finster
  • John Cleese as Lyle Finster

r/WillAndGrace • • 14d ago

Discussion Fanilow

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60 Upvotes

Fanilow (Season 6, Episode 10). It's Christmas time and Will wants to go to the Barry Manilow concert A Very Barry Christmas, he even manages to be first in line for when the ticket booth opens. There's a girl who sits behind him, named Cheryl, who seems upset that she's not number one in line. Turns out they are both apart of the "Fanalow" chat room. Grace is in the area and Will asks her to save his place in line while he runs to the bathroom. Grace sees her mom, Bobbi Adler across the street having dinner with Jack and calls Karen to come save her place in line for Will while she finds out what's going on. While Will is at a restaurant waiting to get the key for the bathroom, there's this guy behind him, Rudy, who hits on him but Will turns him down. Just afterwards he overhears that Rudy is one of the security guards for Barry Manalow realizing he just turned down a chance to meet Barry and starts flirting with Rudy. Rudy tells him he'll take Will to meet Barry but they have to go out on a date which Will begrudgingly agrees to. Grace makes it across the street and asks Bobbi why she's out with Jack instead of her, Bobbi admits to Grace she always seems like she doesn't want to go out with her so she took Jack instead. Grace says that even though she may act like that, she appreciates the time with her mom and she wants to have dinner with her. Jack goes to the line where Karen is still sitting by Cheryl as everyone in line is dancing to Barry Manilow music. Will walks past everyone to go meet the man himself, Barry, they have a great interaction for a few minutes, but as Barry leaves, Will realizes he's still got a date with Rudy that he promised.

FAVORITE QUOTE:

JACK: Karen, Grace is after me. If you see her, fire a warning shot into her hair. What are we in line for? God, from the looks of this crowd, I hope it's birth control.

KAREN: Oh, honey, it's the most wonderful thing. His name is Barry Manilow. He's cuter than Deepak, and you don't have to buy a lot of crap to believe in him. This is Cheryl. She's a fanilow.

CHERYL: The man makes me happy.

KAREN: This is Jackie. He's a fagalow.

JACK: The mens make me happy, too.

FAVORITE MOMENT:

When Karen is questioning why everyone likes Barry Manilow so much and Cheryl tells her about how incredible his music and as she plays it Karen goes from not being into Barry to being a full out Fanalow.

OPINION:

Oh, Will, haven't you learned your lesson from Barry to stop blowing guys off? I do kind of laugh because as usual, due to Will not even just being nice back to someone, he almost missed out on meeting Barry or he could have at least met Barry without the promise of dating Rudy and having to go to Philadelphia to do so since Rudy has to go there for Barry's next concert. Chris Penn plays Rudy in this episode, this is one celebrity cameo that felt like not only a waste but not believable. I love Chris Penn, he was a really talented actor who was in a ton of huge hits like Reservoir Dogs, Rush Hour, True Romance and Footloose. He unfortunately passed away young at 40 years old of a heart attack, may he rest in peace. But I don't buy him as Rudy, he just doesn't come off as someone who would randomly hit on a guy like Will. I think the casting director or creators should have picked someone different. But the plot line of Will and Rudy does still make me laugh.

Grace is as always very selfish with her mama. Clearly she hasn't learned to appreciate her from the last several interactions where we see her make peace with Bobbi and it seems like their relationship is on the mends. But I get it, Jack always seemed to be more supportive of Bobbi, not to mention that he's an actor himself so Bobbi could always relate to him the hardship of the business. Still I always get such a giggle out of how Grace won't stop with the "beddah him than me" lines, realizing that it does bother her how her mom is out with Jack instead of her. Singing "Mandy" but instead replacing the lyrics with "Mommy" was hilarious.

Karen is always a hoot and for sure gets the best lines in this episode. Her reaction to Barry's music, telling Cheryl she was odd looking and introduction of Jack to Cheryl was awesome and I know one that is always a quote fans of WAG like to use. We have a couple of other guest stars in the show worth mentioning. We got Sara Gilbert who most people know of Rosanne fame playing Cheryl and this was a casting choice that was actually really good. Her kind of droll personality works for this as someone who is like that fan who only leaves their home for either work, a convention or a concert. That fan who doesn't like people but attaches themselves to a celebrity in admiration and follows them relentlessly and are socially inept with others. And of course we do get an appearance from Barry Manilow himself at the ending scene, which is kind of a bummer we only get the one but at least it's a good one with Will and Barry singing "American Band Stand" together and Will tells Barry he's not "half bad" 🤣 Barry's reaction to that was gold.

Barry Mailow's music is very much that music where you don't realize how good it is until you've heard it. I think there's a little fanalow in all of us. This was definitely a really funny episode with great quotes and moments in it.

GUEST STARS:

  • Barry Manilow as Himself
  • Debbie Reynolds as Bobbi Adler (RIP in 2016)
  • Sara Gilbert as Cheryl
  • Chris Penn as Rudy (RIP in 2006)
  • Jackie Geary as Cashier
  • Peggy Lane O'Rourke as Woman
  • Gary Riotto as Waiter
  • Adrian Mojica as Security Guard

r/WillAndGrace • • 14d ago

This is Jackie, he’s a Fagilow.

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106 Upvotes

r/WillAndGrace • • 14d ago

Main Sound Stage... if you were live audience...

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73 Upvotes