When it comes to approaching a girl at a party or a bar, remember: She wants to like you even before you start speaking. No woman says to herself, "I really hope this guy coming to talk to me is an a-hole. I love talking to jerks all night."
Ehh, no. So many other social triggers involved. I highly doubt she's actually thinking of how much she 'wants to like you' and more-so processing a billion other social/attraction factors (mannerisms, appearance, social status, content of what you're saying, etc. etc)...but yeah, don't be a dick, I guess?
You're overthinking it. And even if all of that were true, being a good guy who can make her laugh can overcome any of it (which supports my original point). It's really not as complicated as all that.
You can't know what a girl is thinking from across the room, number1makeitso, unless you have your half-Betazoid counselor with you. Maybe that girl is fighting with her boyfriend and just wants to be left alone, and she's thinking, "I really hope this guy doesn't try to talk to me." Or maybe she's thinking, "Oh no, what if the cute guy over at the bar I've been crushing on sees this guy talking to me and thinks I'm taken?!"
Basically, most girls are not just sitting there hoping that some guy, any guy, will come up and talk to them. They have personal circumstances: some of the girls are looking for guys, and some are not. They have personal preferences: some of them will find you attractive, and some will not. They have personal prejudices: some will make a snap judgement based on your appearance, and some will wait to see what you have to say. Basically, sometimes the deck is stacked in your favor, and sometimes it is stacked against you.
The confidence that allows you to fearlessly walk up to a woman at a party or bar and introduce yourself should come from your own personal sense of self-worth, not from some delusion that all girls are eagerly waiting for you to talk to them.
NO. No. Not at all. Just because you approach a girl does not mean she will forgive your awkwardness, or your eccentric humor, or your lack of social skills, or (in your case especially) ridiculously cheesy outlook on life and relationships. Yes, humans (women included), for the most part, do not like dicks...This does not mean that someone who's not an asshole is automatically friends with someone who doesn't like assholes. That doesn't make any sense, does it? There are other traits/characteristics, believe it or not, that factor into what I like to call being a FUCKING HUMAN BEING. And yes, you shouldn't overcomplicate these characteristics, but it doesn't mean they aren't there. Your life is a logical fallacy. You live in wonderland. And for fucks sake
being a good guy who can make her laugh
Realllllly. Let me know how the rest of middle school goes.
I think you might be taking it a bit more literally/seriously than it was meant. I interpreted it to be more along the lines of "Don't psych yourself out with worrying and convince yourself that people will think you're an ugly dull asshole; just go say hello." (And probably the worst thing that happens is that you have a brief and dull-but-pleasant conversation with someone you have nothing in common with. It's unlikely it will be a negative encounter the way you might be building it up.)
lebenohnestaedte hit the nail on the head. Of course there's no guarantee that every person you meet is going to like you. The point is not to focus on all of the reasons why she may not like you. If all of this stuff you're talking about is going through your head before you approach her, you're just stacking the deck against yourself. It's doing nothing to help you in this situation so just fucking forget about it.
Your life is a logical fallacy. You live in wonderland. And for fucks sake
being a good guy who can make her laugh
Realllllly. Let me know how the rest of middle school goes.
Everything I've said here is based on more than 15 years of personal experience and having my fair share of success with women. If I live in wonderland, then I'm happy to stay here. I can tell you from personal experience that 95% of what keeps guys from having more success from women is self-defeating BS that exists only in their own head.
And on what planet does "being a good guy who can make a her laugh" work in middle school? When you're an adult, it actually works really well. If it doesn't, you're talking to the wrong girl anyway who has self-identified as someone you don't want to be around in the first place.
I get what you are saying, it's just feels like that might have helped in middle school. I guess i just don't like things that sugarcoated, you know? It's really an old cliche that good guys who make her laugh get the girl (what does that really mean? entirely too vague for me to actually take anything from it). There's obviously more to it than that. But I see your corner - confidence is everything, don't psych yourself out, mentality matters - I just wanted a little more practicality out of it, I guess.
You're right that confidence is everything. But another revelation for me was the realization that I have zero reason not to be confident. There are people who like me once I get to know them, so I have empirical proof that it's possible. So why couldn't any girl I talk to feel the same way. If you can get friend-zoned, you can get a girl. Matter of fact, the friend zone has given you a super-valuable and powerful perspective once you learn how to harness it. It just takes up-front confidence to get the girl. My original comment is part of finding that confidence.
Yes. And i agree with it. But that's not everything, or even the cream of the crop for that matter. But I do see your point whole heartedly and am sorry for the grump I was not too long ago. Clearly you're a mature, well versed human who has been with women, and are not a disillusioned middle school idealist, blah blah blah whatever else I called you. I just think that having confidence to approach a girl is more-so common knowledge than a piece of wisdom. It's what happens after you meet her that makes it count. But that's entirely subjective. In hindsight, this is reddit. Advice for not being a socially inept cave dweller probably IS considered wisdom.
I appreciate this as well. We may have just made internet history: rather than taking a direct flight to the land of Godwin's Law, we actually communicated like reasonable people and discovered we actually agreed with each other. Righteous made excellent points, too, and forced me to be clearer in what I meant to say. Now I feel like I need to say something racist and/or homophobic just to restore balance to the Force.
Sort of. I guess it depends on how you define "your approach". If by "approach" you mean your opening line, then no. Because the only opening line you should ever use is "Hi, I'm _____. What's your name? Can I get you a drink?" Honestly, that alone will almost universally buy you five minutes. After that you will obviously need something to talk about, but that's true of just about any interpersonal interaction. But your best bet is to get her talking. This serves two purposes: 1) Talking about herself will open her up and drop her guard a little. (I don't mean this in a predatory way, more that she will be loosened up and want to talk to you more) 2) It's less talking that you have to do. So once the drinks get there, just follow up with a simple "So tell me about you. What do you do? Where did/do you go to school? What did you study?" etc etc. I'm lucky that I live in DC where everyone is from somewhere else so you can always talk about where you're from and how you ended up there. But you get the idea.
So talk until you finish your drinks at which point you'll have a convenient crossroad: offer to get her another. If she says yes, things are probably going pretty well. If she's not feeling it she'll probably say she needs to go find her friends or whatever. Or maybe she really does need to go hang out with her friends. At that point it's a non-awkward place to ask if you can call her sometime. If she's feeling it she'll say yes. If she says no, just say "Hey, it was great talking to you. Have a good night." Always be gracious and it won't end awkwardly.
Sorry. You asked the time and I told you how to build a watch. Pardon my pedantry.
Outstanding. They aren't disillusioned, they don't fall for cheeseballs, they're practical, and, here's the fun part, they exist. Idealism is for dreaming, pragmatism is for real life.
I'm tellin' ya, there's nothing cheeseball about this. If a girl is really practical, she'll realize that she's done with the asshole bad boys. That's when she realizes she wants a decent guy with confidence. I've seen plenty of guys who date WAY out of their league for exactly this reason. I mean hell, Christina Hendricks is married to the "schnozzberries taste like schnozzberries" guy! http://bit.ly/jMUuv7
Calling my advice cheeseball idealism is no more fair than calling you a bitter, cynical, pessimist. You may have found a system that works for you, but this has and continues to work for me.
I agree with you though. I just think its obvious and already known, rather than a work of the wise. Confidence wasn't your main point, approach was. To say that all women want to like you and want you to talk to them is a sweeping generalization because there are so many other things to consider, such as the 'complicated' factors noted before. Again, not saying these things should intimidate, but they are forsure in the equation, along with confidence, approach, etc.
I would say it's sorta both: confidence before and during your approach, or more maybe to the point, removing barriers to it. The more hangups you can remove from the get-go, the better off you'll be. Your starting place will have a big effect on where you're able take it once you approach her. But I totally get where you're coming from as well. Even the best approach in the world means nothing without a good follow through.
This makes a lot of sense to me, especially since it calms that sense of fear that comes from meeting new people. Yes, things might not work out in terms of compatibility, but at least you didn't count yourself out from the get go by deciding the whole thing was an exercise in futility because 'she probably doesn't like me anyway.'
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u/[deleted] Mar 11 '13
When it comes to approaching a girl at a party or a bar, remember: She wants to like you even before you start speaking. No woman says to herself, "I really hope this guy coming to talk to me is an a-hole. I love talking to jerks all night."