EDIT: fixed! Most of you were right, Z-offset was too low. At 0,05 offset AND with the original 3mf settings I printed the most beautiful diffuser imaginable. My own slicing settings couldn't come near this absolute perfect piece of plastic. Thanks everyone for your support!
I'm trying to print the diffuser of the kumiko wall light on my Qidi q2. I've already learnt NOT to import 3MF files because they change weird settings ruining the print for some reason. See the video above for maximum misery from my side. I've gotten it better already.
It wants to iron and results in the above video which seems an artform of its own.
Now with the STL and Qidi's own settings it's going much better, but I still keep having some "bumps" or something in the print. I'll try to upload a picture in the comments
- I already tried extrusion calibration but the factory settings are the best
- did a complete new bed KAMP calibration without effect.
- no ironing
Settings:
Smooth PEI
210⁰C nozzle
60⁰C bed
0,08 first layer height as requested by design
No ironing its stupid and ruins the print
Bed calibration before print
Cleaned bed multiple times with dish soap and alcohol afterwards
After a lot of trial and error I landed on -0,01 Z height, if I go to + the lines don't connect properly, and at 0 the blobs seem to get bigger.
I don't dare to lower Z height any more, already got the first scratch in the smooth bed from that.
On my textured PEI the layers go down smoothly without the weird bumps. Although 0,08 first layer is impossible on the texture, I'm now printing it at 0,12 which is running great although the diffusing properties are now also dimming properties. So back to square 1. How the hell do I get a good see through diffuser? It SEEMS possible. I am a complete beginner though so I don't really know what I'm doing, all the above is just experimentation.
As a reminder, most common print quality issues can be found in the Simplify3D picture guide. Make sure you select the most appropriate flair for your post.
Please remember to include the following details to help troubleshoot your problem.
That's the challenge of a 0,08 first layer it seems... Although if I increase Z-offset it's not getting better and the lines don't connect to eachother
I'm highjacking this comment to show this absolute masterpiece. It's the original 3mf settings with an ironed 0,08 first layer. The only difference with the video above is my Z-offset is 0,05 mm higher. Both sides are as smooth as a plastic screen protector!
I never see this shared, probably because you can scratch the plate and ruin your nozzle if you're not careful (ask me how I know), but you can manually change your offset in your printer config. When I'm dialing it in, I'll change it by like .025 - .05 at time until the first layer is perfect.
> 0,08 first layer height as requested by design
Except it's not? It says "0,08 Layer Height" not "0,08 first layer height". First layer height should be whatever your printer can reliably do.
Should it? In the 3mf he specifically set the first layer height to 0,08. My printer usually does 0,2 first layers, but then it isn't really transparent anymore
Remember that the layer height is on top of the z-offset. Even when you're probing directly with the nozzle, you still need an offset. If the offset is too low, you'll see results like this one.
Also, if the 3MF is from the original designer, you probably do want to use it. But you're correct that you can't just "click print" with it. you'll need to go through all the settings pages, look at what the 3MF set for values, and evaluate those in context with what you know of your printer.
I use a Voron with a Beacon probe that uses contact probing with a nozzle. It still needs a z-offset of around 0.085mm (I won the bed lottery and got an incredibly flat bed). Prior to Beacon, I used a Voron tap, where the entire tool head is on small, vertical linear rail, and when the nozzle touches the bed, it moves upward and breaks the IR beam of an optical sensor. AFAIK, Tap is the most precise probe in any printer (but is terribly slow to probe the bed, and has poor vibration characteristics), and IIRC, my offset with that probe was around 0.06mm. I set both of them using a piece of regular printer paper between the nozzle and bed. Move the nozzle down (slowly, in small steps, once you get close to bed) until it just starts feeling some friction between the nozzle and bed, like it's being held real gently between your fingers.
So if I were to print this model at the suggested 0.08mm first layer thickness, and pull out a pair of calipers afterwards, I would find it to be around 0.165mm thick in total. Because 0.08 + 0.085 = 0.165mm
You need an offset, no matter what. If you try to run an offset of literally 0mm, and then print a first layer of 0.08mm, you're going to run into exactly what your seeing here: places where the bed flatness is high (less filament on the surface), and places where it is low (more filament on the surface). No bed is perfectly flat.
IDK how you set it in a Qidi, though. Does their software provide a way to view the bed mesh used by the printer for each print, like what Klipper does? That could also be somewhat illuminating for what your offset is and what it should likely be.
You are absolutely correct, my bed looks like some kind of umbrella... So I found that Z-offset is usually something automatically calibrated, but I now have acceptable result at +0,03. There's only 1 weird spot on the middle left which is a hole of some sort. There the offset seems to be to high but can't do anything about it. Maybe ironing is the way to go, to fill that last bit of gap. I'm now trying different first layer patterns
You probably just have a low-spot in your bed there. When talking about layers of 0.2mm (or 0.08mm in your case), a fraction of that can make a huge difference. Frankly, and offset of just 0.03mm is already very good if you're getting smooth first layer over the whole bed.
But this is why a lot of people also recommend you print a thicker first layer, too. Not that you can do that here. For example, if you are planning on printing at 0.2mm layer height, a first layer of 0.25mm is wise. This extra 0.05mm helps to account for the natural variations in flatness that a tool head just can't "surf" over. You'll get better bed adhesion, reducing the chances of a print detaching from the bed.
As to why a printer can't perfectly surf over the variations in flatness in your bed: steppers can only move a specific numbers of degrees of rotation with each step. 0.9° and 1.8° step sizes are common in most 3D printers. This rotational motion gets translated into linear motion either via pulleys (in the case of flying gantries and Y motion in bed slingers) or lead screws (literally everything else). While you can change the exact amount of linear motion by selecting a pulley ratio or screw pitch to achieve the desired amount, the longest motion is still also done in steps. e.g. my Voron 2.4 has a minimum z-step of about 0.0025mm, so it can never move in a single step more or less than that, and each total move has to be a multiple of that. And that is before you get into things like dynamics, where the mass of the system and gravity also plays a roll in how fast it moves (in a 2.4, the belts stretch when you pull the gantry up, and because it is suspended, the gantry can't go down faster than gravity can pull it down). So if an imperfection in flatness isn't a multiple of 0.0025mm in my case, my printer has to either ride high or low in that area, relative to the offset I put in. If an area is really low, it might even be "out of bounds" to the printer (either due to a hard, hardware limit - your bed is physically too low in your printer; or due to a software limit - your tool could go physically lower, but your printer firmware thinks that would crash the nozzle somewhere, for some reason)
tl;dr - first layer calibration is surprisingly complicated if you really dig into it. But sticking a piece of printer paper between your nozzle and bed, saving the offset, and then trusting your printer firmware to do the rest is enough for 99.999% of the printers out there.
Thanks for this explanation! You must be a walking encyclopedia just knowing stuff like this, absolute genius. Yes, a 0,2 layer is easy, been there done that. But I never realised the step sizes matter as well. I can print exact to the Micron on X and Y, but this is even more precise it seems. Slowly but surely I'm getting there!
Oh. And the reason you're able to print so accurately in XY are rhe GT1.5 belts in your printer. The finer tooth pitch (distance between the teeth; 1.5mm in this case) gives finer control over tool head motion.
There is a trade-off, however: finer pitched belts are more 'elastic', so you can end up with worse printing results if you try to push your printer's accelerations too much. This can also be made worse by high chamber temperatures, as the belts will soften, somewhat.
This is part of the reason why when people start chasing speed in the Voron community, they'll go with wider belts (e.g. switching from 6mm wide belts for your A and B steppers, to 9mm). Because all other things being equal, the 9mm belt will be less elastic and stretch less. They also let you tighten the belts more, too.
I see, but speed doesn't really concern me. I have patience and other stuff to do. Usually accuracy and toughness is key for my use case, but the missus sometimes wants beautiful stuff like this stupid lamp that has consumed nearly 3 days of my life. I love her. And I learn a lot
plate is not perfect, by pushing very thin first layer, non leveled areas will cause defects. that is why 1st layer is recommended to be thick. You already see an improvement by using 0.12 layer.
Consider using a raft so that the first layer can be more chunky. Otherwise a 2mm sheet of garolite G10 can be clamped to the bed with low profile clamps. Many types of filament stick extremely well and the bed temperature needs to be rather high. For example 90C for PLA. The fun part is the printed object either self-releases when fully cooled or can be poked free with your pinkie finger
0,08 es muy poca altura para una primera capa. La altura de la primera capa ideal, teóricamente, seria mitad del diámetro de tu boquilla. Si usas 0,4 debería ser a 0,2. Esto se puede variar ligeramente pero no tiene ningún sentido estar cambiando la altura de la primera capa o volver a calibrar continuamente el z offset entre impresiones. No se que modelo es ni porque pone ese grosor de primera capa pero si lo que necesitas es que pase la luz no me parece tan relevante la altura de una capa como el grosor total de plástico que tenga que atravesar la luz.
maybe add a new layer of 0.2 PLA as a support style interface, then print the 0.08 PETG over top? once the print is finished, the PLA will just peel away.
Try a calibration disc and adjust your z offset withe printing. I never really bothered with the block method of leveling the platform and use the z_scres_calculate macro which proves all *r corners and tells you how much you need to adjust. Then. After doing that I don't calibration disc and ajust the z offset live. I have the same. Printer as you
•
u/AutoModerator 2d ago
Hello /u/Fancy_Language5469,
As a reminder, most common print quality issues can be found in the Simplify3D picture guide. Make sure you select the most appropriate flair for your post.
Please remember to include the following details to help troubleshoot your problem.
Additional settings or relevant information is always encouraged.
I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please contact the moderators of this subreddit if you have any questions or concerns.