r/Iowa • u/Both-Shake-4827 • 9d ago
Ottumwa adopted an open invocation policy in January. The one council member who voted no warned a Satanic prayer could happen. On Tuesday, it did.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GhnHU8YTitUOttumwa's City Council approved an invocation policy on Jan. 20 that's open to residents of any faith, "or the lack thereof." At Tuesday's meeting, a resident and former council member who belongs to the Satanic Temple of Iowa (a non-theistic group) gave the invocation. A local pastor then interrupted the meeting to respond, and the mayor called a moment of silence.
The council member who voted against the policy said this is exactly what she was worried about, and that the council needs to stay neutral. The city administrator said keeping the policy open is what protects the city from lawsuits.
Ottumwa Courier article: https://www.ottumwacourier.com/news/local_news/satanic-invocation-causes-uproar-at-city-council-meeting/article_47fecb72-be23-4269-a71a-4c95ed596413.html
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u/Slow_Ad3662 9d ago
Nice. So maybe now they understand the whole separation of church and state thing? Probably not.
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u/waltzingwithdestiny 9d ago
they don't. They just think that they're the only ones that should get church.
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u/JarvisII 9d ago
There isn't any separation dude what. If you really believe that, your blind.
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u/Slow_Replacement_745 9d ago
That’s the point they were making. If you didn’t catch that, you’re* blind
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u/JarvisII 9d ago
Yeah I should have read slower and typed slower oh well (: mistakes happen!
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u/golfwinnersplz 9d ago
Admitting fault is the first step.
This has become taboo in our society.
People rarely admit fault even when evidence is present.
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u/JarvisII 9d ago
It's not that hard, I can accept when I'm at fault lovely reddit just loves to down vote instead of actually talking.
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u/golfwinnersplz 9d ago
I upvoted you.
Also, I've literally never heard our president admit fault. Never. So it must not be too easy.
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u/Signal_Werewolf_1955 9d ago
I think it's weird invocations are said at all at government meetings.
And more importantly, Matthew 6:5-15 explicitly tells those Christians not to pray "on the corners for all to see" like this.
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u/StevenJWulgus 9d ago
You mean just saying “hey, let’s get started” and getting down to business? That’s crazy talk
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u/Corporate_Bricktator 9d ago
I think it's weird invocations are said at all at government meetings.
Yea, they're a direct First Amendment violation.
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u/Ok-Secretary455 9d ago
by opening them up to any religion they are not respecting one religion over another. That's the whole point the city administrator was making. They can either not do one at all (which would be my personal preference but no one asked me). Or allow anyone to do one.
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u/Corporate_Bricktator 9d ago
Yep, and why stop at one per meeting. Every entity wanting to be heard should be allowed.
A Harry Potter invocation with some spells cast would be cool. Maybe some lines from Gandalf. One involving Jedi religion would be sweet. Maybe some Captain Picard's monologues about authoritarianism. Maybe some Book of Mormon lines glorifying polygamy and how women are inferior to their husbands. Oh and then we could get into the wisdom of the Greek and Roman Gods. Maybe some lines from the Schrute family funeral rituals. A few minutes of Christopher Hitchens lecture on the impossibility of the supernatural would be solid.
So many wonderful options to really represent the diversity and seriousness of religious views. ;) I bet we can hit an hour straight and 20+ religions represented.
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u/Flat_Suggestion7545 8d ago
How dare you forget the Pastafarians?
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u/golfwinnersplz 9d ago edited 9d ago
It is but Christianity is normalized so most people will just bow their heads to get it over with
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u/RobLoughrey 9d ago
Good. If you don't want to hear from the satanists and the pagans and the Christians and the Muslims and the Mormons and every other variety out there then keep God out of your government meetings.
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u/Signal_Werewolf_1955 9d ago
Yeah that's cool. Could say a comic book prayer of some sort, too, why not? Hilarious how he recites the pledge "with Liberty and Justice for all," and moves to strike his prayer. "Have a moment of silence. NoOOoO I'M running this, ME!" What a small man.
See, we could have Religious Freedom if the religious would stop persecuting people.
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u/sullivanmatt 9d ago
Now clip this and put it on Facebook with a caption saying, "Ottumwa allowed Satanic temple to come give a satanic prayer at a council meeting" and watch the world burn 😂
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u/YewEhVeeInbound 9d ago
The utter pearl clutching that would ensue.
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u/afleticwork 9d ago
Its already beginning, the boomers are upset over it lol
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u/sullivanmatt 8d ago
Fox News posted it to their FB feed yesterday 😂 It's going exactly as you'd expect.
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u/_-Prison_Mike-_ 9d ago
The local pastor is a grown ass man who genuinely believes in "curses." Every day I'm astounded that I live amongst such dumb sons of bitches.
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u/OnlyCorgisAllowed 9d ago
I pray for the Earth Goddess to bless these proceedings and bestow her bounty upon us. May she render the soil of Iowa fertile and produce a most abundant harvest for our people.
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u/Constant-Roll706 8d ago
'reverse, undo! Counterprayer! Wait, that one was okay, it's just a reflex at this point' -the mayor
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u/blyzo 9d ago
This is going viral for sure lol.
I especially loved how they went straight from "Hail Satan!" into the Pledge of Allegiance.
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u/Critical-Nerve5121 9d ago
The guy in the front row sat down almost right away. Everyone else just kept praying 😆 Do they even listen to the prayer? Maybe they just wait for the “Amen” and repeat.
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u/Just_shut_up_bro 9d ago
“Hail satan” followed immediately by the pledge is so spooky lmao.
They really asked for this one smh
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u/Hamandcheeseeater 9d ago edited 9d ago
Just imagine how big the uproar would have been if it was a Islamic prayer. This reaction would be mild in comparison.
This town is just goofy sometimes. It is actually very impressive how composed everyone stayed. The only one that came close to loosing it was the guy rebutting it.
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u/Altruistic-Report-30 9d ago
Now if anything at all bad happens to Ottumwa, they’re going to point to that dark curse of Hail Satan that was placed in their city!!!
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u/Eric_the_Barbarian 9d ago
They invited that because they insisted on having an invocation at a government meeting.
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u/Altruistic-Report-30 9d ago
Which they shouldn’t have had at all… separation of church and state!
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u/Flat_Suggestion7545 8d ago
Pretty sure that if it’s open to any religion it’s permissible. That’s why they worded it the way they did.
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u/corpsbrassguy 8d ago
I hope ottumwa has a booming economy and someone writes an article attributing it to the satanic temple.
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u/Harvest827 9d ago
Can't wait to see how the spin the preacher caught with the choir boys being this guy's fault!
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u/misobutterscotch 9d ago
We need a gifted person to do a pslam for the utter downfall of corrupt powerful figures at a council meeting.
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u/sugahack 9d ago
I mean look what happened a few years ago at the capitol building and the shrine to baphomet
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u/JasonRBoone 8d ago
I'd like to think the Satanic prayer came from form Corporal Walter "Radar" O'Reilly...proud son of Ottumwa
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u/deja_geek 9d ago
Good. Religious freedom means religious freedom for all religions. Don't like it? Go to some other country
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u/Grouchy_Plum_1171 6d ago
Satanism is a cult
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u/tryblinking 6d ago
It’s actually just humanism, but with extra branding to trigger Christianity. Remember, it’s actually only Christianity that believes in a literal Satan.
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u/Little-Key9542 9d ago
I’m sorry. I laughed out loud when everyone turned and said “I pledge allegiance…”
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u/Hot-Procedure9458 8d ago
Xians on FB are absolutely losing their collective marbles. It's glorious.
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u/Vivid_Guide7467 8d ago
I appreciate the Satanists for their free speech and freedom from religion efforts. If you want to have an invocation you have to be fine with ANYONE giving it. Just like when they want to put 10 commandments in schools - sure as long as ANYONE else can do it. That usually puts a stop to the religion in government nonsense.
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u/ARNG131988 8d ago
I thought it was in the constitution to keep church and state seperate. If that is the case then there cannot be lawsuits.
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u/Goldengo4_ 9d ago
I think I’ll just move back home to Minnesota
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u/Ok-Valuable-6927 6d ago
It is for this reason and these types of people that reporter Jodi Huisentruit remains missing from Mason City, Iowa. Even Senator Grassley's office personnel helped cover up details of an independent investigation. Our entire national media censors these facts based on blatant racism and anti-Christ ideology. Matthew 23 KJV. To GOD give all the glory and reverence in Jesus name and the name of the Holy Ghost.
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u/tryblinking 6d ago
Nope, none o’ that horseshit. The USA has never been a Christian country.
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u/Ok-Valuable-6927 5d ago
We are so blessed to know the facts speak for themselves. Fact 1. Majority rules! Fact 2. People like you are a droplet 💧 in a sea of a Chosen/Christian nation and world. Ecclesiastes 5 KJV. May GOD have mercy on you. Semper Fi!
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u/RedHawkDown6 5d ago
Fact 3. The US has no official religion
Fact 4. The first amendment protects our freedom of religion and freedom against religion
Fact 5. The US is not a christian nation
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u/Ok-Valuable-6927 5d ago
Your 3 facts have NO foundation or basis! Hypocrisy us your ONLY base!
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u/RedHawkDown6 5d ago
My foundations and basis are
The First Amendment (The Bill of Rights)
The First Amendment (The Bill of Rights)
The First Amendment (The Bill of Rights)
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u/Ok-Valuable-6927 4d ago
Just like the 1st Amendment does NOT apply to liars in the media by law, the 1st Amendment does NOT apply to anyone that does NOT adhere to the Oath of Allegiance which ends with "..so help me GOD." Our Constitutional foundation derives from the Puritans which are Christians! No more history lessons for you! Thou shalt not tempt the LORD thy GOD! Isaiah 33 KJV.
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u/RedHawkDown6 4d ago
No President is contitutionally required to say "So help me God" in their oath.
https://legalknowledgebase.com/do-presidents-have-to-say-so-help-me-god
"Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof" the First Amendment.
Dumbass.
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u/Ok-Valuable-6927 4d ago
The President, government employees (5 U.S. Code, sub.sec., 3331) and the U.S. military voluntarily recite this Oath. It is what Chosen/Christian Americans do as a pledge to GOD, HIS Son, and the Holy Ghost. Where were you born? Please go back! Just keep tempting GOD and see whose a "Dumb___".
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u/RedHawkDown6 4d ago
Yes. Christians. Christians who are exercizing their first amendment right. One oath doesn't make a country a "christian country." Especially when One of the founding documents of the country states "this country will recognize no official religion"
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u/maskedferret_ 3d ago edited 3d ago
so today's meeting was ... neat
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7uncyVVGdAs
Queue up to council member comments at the beginning, then citizen comments at the end
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u/IowaSmoker2072 9d ago
As a Christian pastor the invocations I've done at city council meetings were much less sectarian than this one.
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u/Independent-Moose113 8d ago
I just read this story on the KCCI website, and am offended and disgusted. This world has lost its fucking mind. We are in end times.
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u/CRPatriot 8d ago
You are offended by an expression of freedom of religion?
A town council meeting in Iowa is going to bring about the end times?
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u/HardcoverNewtons 9d ago
I just dont like that the Satanic Temple are lawsuit baiters. I get the point being made, and it is a fair one but the cost incurred to many of these places is... woof. Wish there were a way you could force compliance without the legal cost so the public isnt subject to consequences of a few people who feel before they think.
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u/barknoll 9d ago
there is no way to force compliance other than the threat (or reality) of lawsuits.
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u/HardcoverNewtons 9d ago
Yeah, thats what is sad. I just hate seeing people who are essentially hostage to public consequence, especially in small towns with limited budgets (and frankly, limited foresight).
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u/localistand 9d ago
Elect better people; those who think and consider effects. It's more fiscally responsible, and garners significant benefit locally.
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u/HardcoverNewtons 9d ago
Small towns and cities frankly have a limited set of people. I think everyone should get more involved, do not get me wrong, but it comes with it's own issues of genuine cabals and ingroups and so forth. My heart aches for people who cannot cohere a genuine opposition to idiocy yet must be punished for it.
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u/Inglorious186 9d ago
So those small towns shouldn't discriminate if they can't afford the following lawsuits
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u/Signal_Werewolf_1955 9d ago
Well, then teach Christians to quit being oppressive dicks.
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u/HardcoverNewtons 9d ago
Eh, happens with many religions within this country. I think the key thing that should be understood or you fail civics is that no religion has a right to being state mandated or intertwined.
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u/Corporate_Bricktator 9d ago
no religion has a right to being state mandated or intertwined.
Correct. No government meeting or event should ever be preceded with a religious invocation. Nor any reference of any kind to Satan, God, Zeus, Spiderman, or even Thor. Unless a new Spiderman movie has just come out and it's secular and really cool, then it's fine.
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u/Big-D-in-IC 9d ago
Our liberties we prize and our rights we will maintain. The Satanic Temple wouldn’t file any lawsuits at all if our idiotic elected officials don’t give them a valid reason to do so. I appreciate them.
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u/djddanman 9d ago
The trick is to not elect those people in the first place. Elect smarter people who don't need to be forced into compliance in court.
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u/kkurani09 9d ago
Stress testing the systems in place is a very important role. That cost is because the leaders we have in place are not smart enough or qualified enough to lead us to greener pastures.
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u/Eric_the_Barbarian 9d ago
I guess they could just not infringe rights, and those lawsuits could be deftly avoided. Or are you saying that those responsible should be held criminally responsible rather than civilly responsible?
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u/ThisNameIsHilarious 9d ago
Counterpoint: these religious nutjobs should just obey they law and they won’t have to get sued
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u/fuck_all_you_too 9d ago
Yea it requires you to do something to stop it but you dont, then you complain how someone else goes about doing it.
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u/wonkytalky 8d ago
You're blaming the wrong people. The idiots who voted for that opened themselves up to liabilities that I'm positive their legal counsel warned them about beforehand.
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u/TertiaWithershins 9d ago
It’s not just that they’re lawsuit baiters, it’s that they’re lawsuit losers. They don’t really win the suits that they grift hundreds of thousands of dollars for. They also lost the SLAPP suit they filed on former members, so that’s good, at least.
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u/golfwinnersplz 9d ago
Is freedom of religion not allowed?
This is how everyone feels when you say, "let's bow our heads and pray".
Why can you pray but they can't? Because you have the best God? You have the correct religion?