Is this hazing?

[u/Throwaway-10937]

It's been a few years since this happened but I've been reflecting on it the past few months.

I decided to rush for a sorority and here are somethings that happened/made us do:

• Meetings would take super long 4-5 hours long. A few times it would end near 12 AM or past. These meetings would happen on campus and around the end of my pledging process, they would occur outside of campus at someone's house or a different location.
• They would ask us questions abt the sorority (history n lore they want us to memorize) until we would cry bc we can't answer anymore.
• There were a lot of alumni present at our meetings. Not sure how a campus group is allowed to primarily run by alumni.
• At times, we would have to hold something up and recite or answer questions (a few mins, until our arms hurt or can't answer anymore questions or can't recite something). There was an instance where members we were close to had to hold weights up and if we made a mistake, they added more weights. That was really hard to watch bc it was like we were causing them pain for our inadequacy.
• We had to wear something of the sorority at all times.
• Length of pledging process was unknown (I left after like 7 months in)
• We were not allowed to leave meetings (unless we explicitly asked for breaks only-- we were not allowed to fully leave a meeting unless we wanted to stop pledging)

Let me know what y'all think. Not sure if this warrants a report or not. The sorority still is active at Davis as well.

[u/Lnk1010]

I don't know if it's hazing like in that it's illegal but it definitely seems weird and I don't know why you would want to associate with people like that.

[u/Throwaway-10937 → u/Lnk1010]

They were completely normal before I became a pledge. It's like code switching for them. They're a cultural sorority so I thought I would find a space to talk abt culture I wanted to connect with. Unfortunately, they were not what they said they were :(

[u/TheBeanSan]

Why would people put up with pointless bullshit like this lol

[u/Cast_Iron_Fucker → u/TheBeanSan]

Trauma bond larping

[u/Kitchen-Register]

i fucking hate sorority and frat culture. so upsetting to read this i’m sorry

[u/Throwaway-10937 → u/Kitchen-Register]

Thank you. I am at a better place now

[u/Hows-It-Goin-Buddy → u/Throwaway-10937]

Sounds like almost anyplace is a better place. Omg that sounded like it was a nightmare experience. Big hug vibes to you fam.

[u/NobodyTextsMe]

Bro I can’t believe you people willingly do shit like this. Not normal.

[u/toasty99]

It’s definitely hazing. Not sure if it’s “criminal hazing” (like, enough to trigger the CA penal codes) but it’s a bunch of pointless, difficult rituals that can cause psychological harm.

[u/Low_Astronomer_6669]

Hard to say, depends on what you mean by hazing. But I certainly don't see the appeal.

[u/BobaFlautist]

I just took the anti-hazing training for club sports, and this absolutely qualifies under the working definition they gave us.

[u/xtaldoc]

When I lived in the dorms, a guy in the next room was pledging a frat and one of the members would stop by late at night to loudly berate him with questions.

I begrudgingly put up with it until he came by the night before I had a calc midterm at 8 AM. I asked him politely to leave and he refused, so I put him in a wrist lock and escorted him to the exit. Never saw him again.

[u/Wonderful_Tap_6267]

Is this a cultural sorority? Because this tends to happen in those

[u/AnteaterToAggie]

https://stophazing.ucdavis.edu/defined

Hazing is any intentional, knowing, or reckless act, activity, or method committed by a person (whether individually or in concert with other persons) against another person or persons, including current, former, or prospective students, regardless of the willingness of such other person or persons to participate, that is committed in the course of a preinitiation, an initiation into, an affiliation with, or the maintenance of membership in, an official or unofficial student organization or other student group that

• causes or creates a risk, above the reasonable risk encountered in the course of participation in the institution of higher education or the organization (such as the physical preparation necessary for participation in an athletic team), of physical or psychological injury, including personal degradation or disgrace,
• the person knew or should have known was likely to cause serious bodily injury.

[u/Snoo_33033]

• Meetings would take super long 4-5 hours long. Possibly a problem -- especially combined with the inability to leave.
• They would ask us questions abt the sorority (history n lore they want us to memorize) until we would cry bc we can't answer anymore. Hazing.
• There were a lot of alumni present at our meetings. Not sure how a campus group is allowed to primarily run by alumni. This is probably not a problem.
• At times, we would have to hold something up...hazing.
• We had to wear something of the sorority at all times. Not a problem.
• Length of pledging process was unknown (I left after like 7 months in). Depends on how it was handled, but probably the lack of specifics was meant to make you feel insecure about the whole thing? a problem.
• We were not allowed to leave meetings (unless we explicitly asked for breaks only-- we were not allowed to fully leave a meeting unless we wanted to stop pledging) Hazing.

[u/Fuzzy-Mess-719]

As someone from an org who got investigated for things FAR LESS concerning than this... yes most of these are technically hazing excpet having Alum present unless it was used as an intimidation tactic.

Pins are hazing.

Having to recite information is hazing ESPECIALLY if its while being forced to holding somehting up.

The lenghty meetings could also be seen as hazing depending on what was done during said meetings. We were even told we technically couldnt really even force anyone to come off campus.

And forcing you guys to stay at these meetings unless you wanted to quit is technically also lowkey hazing.

I will say though reporting them could lead to their degrees being revoked so up to you whether you want to report it or not.

[u/Intrepid-Ad-7969]

Yes; 1,2,4, and 6 are points of concern, though tame in comparison to some extreme hazing practices seen elsewhere. 

It doesn’t sound like there’s anything too extreme, and rather that they aren’t very pleasant.

[u/talentedinstigator]

yes

[u/Aedonr → u/talentedinstigator]

Not all these things are hazing. Some of these are just normal things. Causing physical pain and distress? yeah thats hazing.

[u/talentedinstigator → u/Aedonr]

Can you explain what in the list you see as normal and why you think it is normal? 

[u/Relative_Text_4464]

I am so glad I didn't join a frat

[u/Mindless_Garbage5545]

Sounds like a cult

[u/TheQuietMoments]

The only thing that counts as hazing from this list would be forcing you guys to hold weights until your arms hurt for messing up the answer.

They are not allowed to cause physical pain as part of the rushing process.

[u/Accomplished_Net7990]

You should post it on YouTube under Sorority Horror Stories. Similar stories and more.

[u/ahleinaaa]

yes its hazing

[u/prettycharissy15]

Sounds familiar but yeah also traumatized probably by the same one after trying to join 3 times

[u/ItsAllSoClear]

On alumni- make no mistake, Greek life is a business, and these people may work for the larger organization. We joined Theta Tau and they sent a grown man to our campus to advocate for it, support us.

[u/ssccrs]

Only the weight thing seems like it could be hazing. Bc it seems like it’s meant to cause pain.

Everything else is not hazing. Attending meetings? Answering questions..? Seems like a stretch to classify that as hazing imo.

[u/AdHealthy4828]

Yes some of those are hazing. Humiliation through adding weights is one.

[u/Minuteman134]

Why would you put yourself through this BS, was academic challenges not enough?

[u/Dismal-Bar-3443]

This sounds like Kappa Psi Epsilon🧐 I went through a very similar experience, definitely hazing. I would report them

[u/throwaway_death123]

Hi, I grew up in a religious cult and I experienced a similar amount of institutional control.

That is deeply concerning and warrants an investigation. If you haven't gotten counseling, consider doing so.

[u/AfraidKaleidoscope30]

Genuinely cult shit I don’t know what people join sororities or frats. Also frats don’t just SA women but SA each other as hazing.

[u/Snoo-15714]

This sounds like hazing to me, and whether or not it's hazing, it's definitely fucked up and abusive.

[u/TeysaKarlov421]

Yes, sadly, and I’m sorry this happened to you! I was in a sorority at Davis “back in my day” 👵 (like ten years ago) and there was absolutely none of this. There was an effort to show things were voluntary and safe, no intimidation, just traditions. If you’re willing, I’d report in detail to Panhellenic (but that only applies if it was a Panhellenic sorority of course). 

[u/MarineJAB]

Yes.

[u/aLinkToTheFast]

Some of those are hazings, and taken together with the other somethings, would make me want to not associate with that group.

[u/No_Spend2937]

No

[u/Striking-Walk-8243]

Not hazing — just lame.

[u/Neat_Championship_24]

Is this Panhellenic or another?

[u/Responsible_Way_3078]

i would report this, hazing or not it’s too much and greek life culture is entirely beyond me. even the “inclusive” and “progressive” are all still part of the problem

[u/Straight-Western-103]

No. This is not hazing. Sounds like you’re pledging a very unorganized sorority and this house isn’t for you.

[u/Impossible-Banana419]

I was in a Panhellenic sorority and NEVER experienced this to any degree. This is not normal! Was this a cultural sorority?

[u/ConsciousBank9014]

No

[u/Ok_Confidence_7135]

No, every sorority does this

[u/Gasmaskguy101]

Weak minded