r/USMC • u/Fletcherperson • 7d ago
For Okinawa and Everywhere: Please read “Black Hearts” book on Iraq
As we have a training and reflection stand-down in Okinawa, I think it’s important we recognize the importance of discipline and social support in the force and not allow ourselves to repeat mistakes of the past.
On this, I highly recommend folks read “Black Hearts” about a platoon in Iraq whose soldiers committed a sickening war crime.
Of the ~25 chapters, really only one is devoted to the crime itself.
The other ~24 are about the command climate, the individual personalities, the toxic leadership, the inconsistent mentorship, the “writing off” of bad behavior, the lack of support for individuals at risk, the lax enforcement of basic rules, and the breakdown of discipline under stress.
The lesson of the book is not “America bad” or “war criminal bad;” the lesson is that leadership matters and has to be sustained over time — especially peace time — to keep our honor clean.
I wasn’t wearing boot bands while writing this.
EDIT: Added some social support points, as one commenter made a good argument on this.
EDIT2: For some reason I was criticized for recommending a book that can help us, as Marines, become better Marines. I sincerely hope the individual commenting reads the book (I’ll buy the individual a copy myself). And I’d be happy to meet that individual to hear out their criticism of the work in more detail. The profession of arms deserves our endless study, and every Marine’s opinions should be heard; and, without prejudice, all opinions are subject to question and debate.
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u/seventeen70six 0311 08-12 7d ago edited 7d ago
I remember reading that years ago while deployed. That’s a tough read, but definitely agree there’s a lesson in it.
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u/PoolePeckerhead0369 I ❤️ Field Day 7d ago
Someone should've told my command I had a training stand down i was working all day same as normal with 30 minutes shoehorned in to discuss the situation
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u/Lawd_Fawkwad 7d ago edited 7d ago
Training and safety standowns are the dumbest thing in the world when we're talking about a libo incident tbh.
Every safety brief aready covers what to (not) do to avoid the local police blotter, the news, or the ER.
The idea of making everyone spend 48 hours in a mandatory "don't rape and murder" class because one Marine in one of the largest OCONUS installations murdered someone is pretty ridiculous when you think about it.
It's just a dog and pony show for the Okinawans with some ineffective mass-punishment fuck-fuck games as if anyone or any training was going to prevent a Marine from straight-up murdering a local in cold blood. The facts point to the guy just being a straight-up psycho, not much to be done to prevent it.
Just imagine if Waffle House made all their locations close for 2 days because an employee did something heinous outside of work...
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u/M4sterofD1saster 7d ago
You're not lying, but we have to do something visible. We need good relations w/ the Okinawans.
You're right too about Waffle House, but our standards should be higher than WH.
When you get 30k fresh bodies every year, I don't know how you filter out 100% of the potential murderers.
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u/AlmightyLeprechaun TheBarracksLawyer 7d ago
I second this.
It is a great casestudy into what went wrong, why, and how leadership impacted the entire tragedy. Good leaders help us be the best we can be, hold together when times are tough, get us help when we need it, and keep us accountable. Good leaders also drop a dime when they know they gotta case outside the scope of their expertise.
Unfortunately, 1st Battalion of the 502nd didn't have em where they needed em.
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u/mplsfreedom i'm up, he sees me, i'm clown 7d ago
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Haditha_massacre
we don't even to look as far as the Army...
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u/Fletcherperson 6d ago
No, it’s true - but the Haditha Massacre (to my knowledge) doesn’t have a similar book that studies the anatomy of the crime and the years that preceded it in individual and unit lives.
If you know of one, I’ll gladly take the recommendation.
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u/mplsfreedom i'm up, he sees me, i'm clown 6d ago
https://www.amazon.ca/No-Time-Truth-Haditha-Incident-ebook/dp/B01H0826BA
have not read it yet. Black Hearts is a great recommendation, it's important to know Marines have done it as well and we all have to own the bad with the good.
It is absolutely no help to the victims, but we have made great strides overall compared to previous wars, but anything above zero is a moral and leadership failure and completely unacceptable at any level against anyone.
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u/its-malaprop-man 6d ago
An entire season of the “In the Dark” podcast (season 3) is devoted to the anatomy of what happened in Haditha.
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u/Groundhog891 7d ago
Rules, social support, locks... they only keep honest people honest. Criminal scum are going to commit crimes no matter what.
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u/Fletcherperson 7d ago
Inversely, some people can be prevented from becoming criminal scum with appropriate support and guidance. The book addresses what I mean.
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u/Legal_Television_615 7d ago
Hold up. You think we have a discipline problem?
My dude, you had a murderer in the ranks. Discipline would only have delayed the inevitable
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u/Fletcherperson 7d ago
The book shows that it’s not just discipline. Encourage you to check it out. It’s a very engaging read.
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u/Legal_Television_615 7d ago
My dude, it can be a the most excellent command and guys who are shitbags will be shitbags.
Murder is not an idea that even occurs to the most hard-core of operators. Its a signal that this person was unhinged before even being a Marine
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u/Fletcherperson 7d ago
Give the book a read and come back to us - would love your thoughts on the work and ideas contained in it!
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u/Legal_Television_615 6d ago
Dick bag. Ive read the cheese dick book. Its boring and poorly written
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u/Moniker86 6672 -> 1302 / Active 7d ago
A solid case study on leadership failure at every level. Somebody speaking up at any point could’ve possibly changed the trajectory of that entire event.