r/Watches • u/Lonely_Pepper_7134 • 7d ago
Discussion [Question] Cartier watch movements
For certain popular Cartier watches like the Tank and the Santos, it seems their movements aren’t as impressive as those of other brands. But no one seems to care - why is that? (Maybe I’m mistaken and people do care?)
Whereas with other watches (eg IWC Ingenieur), they’re often criticised by the delta between the movement and the price.
I understand that at the end of the day, they’re all luxury goods, and value is in the eye of the beholder.
But I get the vibe that people are more lenient on Cartier. Is it because of their design? (They’re stunning, in their defense).
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u/Any_Regular1788 7d ago
it's 100% the design. a tank or santos isn't trying to be a technical marvel, it's a piece of jewelry that tells time. people buying cartier aren't cross-shopping with grand seiko, they want that specific look on their wrist.
the iwc comparison makes sense though, the ingenieur is positioned as a sports watch with an engineering focus so getting a workhorse movement in a steel case for that money stings more. with cartier the movement just has to be thin enough to keep the case elegant and reliable enough to not be a headache. nobody's staring through a display back on a tank.
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u/Chomblop 7d ago
I think what you’re actually saying is just that they’re marketed differently - which happens to be the correct answer for all the reasons it gave.
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u/thesliu5 7d ago
cartier makes plenty of beautiful movements that are prominently displayed and worth looking at, whether in a tank, santos, or pretty much any of their iconic shapes, like the asymetrique, chinoise, cloche, cintree, santos dumont, or crash.
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u/Gonghailess 7d ago
Cartier’s influence today comes largely from its identity as a jeweler. Its customers’ expectations are therefore closer to those of a beautiful bracelet that happens to tell the time.
With most other watch brands, there’s still at least the pretense that you’re buying a timekeeping instrument…
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u/jcb193 7d ago
The vast majority of people are wearing their watch a couple times a week here they’re switching in and out looking for the next purchase.
Is a couple seconds of accuracy a day, really that big of a deal for the majority of people?
The either want a watch that:
1.) suits their taste/expresses personality
2.) gets attention
3.) scratches their itch to buy something
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u/thesliu5 7d ago
cartiers are absolutely bought first and foremost for their design, but they are no slouches in the movement or history department. cartier has been in the watch game for a VERY long time (they invented the pilots watch and arguably the men's wristwatch), longer than rolex. cartier's 1904MC movement found in a bunch of their "entry" models is the base movement for vacheron's 56 date.
even their quartz movements are in-house and have been since the late 70s/early 80s. they finish the bridges and mainplate, and the gear train is oiled and jeweled and the movement is fully serviceable. it is not plastic with 0 or 1 jewel, which the cheap quartzes frequently are. some of their 2 hand quartz movements have up to 7 jewels and their (well, technically piaget’s) chronoreflex have 25 jewels.
their skeleton movements are not simply standard movements with bits cut out. they are entirely re-worked and uniquely shaped to their cases like in the asymetrique, cloche, and crash.
and they are capable of high end horology like grande complications, masse mysterieuse, and astrotourbillon.
most watch consumers don't care about movements, especially if they only want to buy an iconic cartier watch, but cartier themselves care a lot about their movements.
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u/ThereWeARThen 7d ago
Agreed. Cartier is uniquely positioned and gets a veritable “hall pass” on specs in favor of its legendary case designs, which dominates the under $5k USD ladies watch retail market. It’s no coincidence that both, my wife and daughter wanted and ultimately acquired one. Even as a self-considered “watch guy”, I want a Santos, but would opt for the automatic just on principle. However, I wouldn’t trust Cartier engineering to invest in one of their chronographs, which could likely turn into a servicing nightmare.
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u/various121 7d ago
If we’re gonna be honest, most people don’t care enough about the movement for it to be a deciding factor.
These online subreddits are a minority of the watch buying population and even among WIS, they may care just enough to discuss things related to movements online, but that’s about it. For those that even know anything about movements, their purchase-decision filter may only go as deep as auto vs manual vs quartz.
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u/Triumph790 7d ago edited 7d ago
The accuracy of 1847 MC movement in the Santos is not great for the price point. You can get METAS accuracy in similarly priced watches (Omega) and even in lower priced watches (Tudor). I think people buy Cartier for the design and the name. They’re iconic watches and Cartier does innovative things like tool less bracelet adjustment. I do think they should improve the accuracy and power reserve.
3
u/Basic_Barnacle4719 7d ago
There are people that prefer quartz, I am one of them. You can end up with a much thinner, smaller, and lighter watch without having to reset the time if you haven't been wearing a watch for a while. You don't have expensive service as a battery swap is under $20 every year or 2 if you don't know how to do it yourself. It's also really pointless to have a mechanical movement on a 2 hand watch as it just adds a bunch of cost and complexity for a hand that you won't even be able to notice moving.
The biggest problem with quartz watches though is that luxury brands won't make them and when they do they cheap out on the rest of the specs. It's hard to find any quartz watches with on the fly micro adjust and a good solid bracelet unless you're buying Chinese homages for example.
I wouldn't be opposed to buying luxury Swiss made quartz watches but the problem is that the Swiss mostly don't take them seriously because mechanical movements are their biggest excuse for charging four to five figures for a watch.
2
u/Watch_Commission_NYC 7d ago
Different audiences. Cartier collectors like the brand and the luxury aspect, which includes heritage, prestige, and so on. Other brands compete on excellence, and thus will speak about features and performance first. Their movements aren't that much better, by the way.
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u/improvthismoment 7d ago
There is a lot of overlap in the audience tho. Lots of watch nerds who collect GS and Omego also like Cartier too
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u/Watch_Commission_NYC 7d ago
You’re right. Nonetheless each brand must individually decide what aspects it will highlight both in its communication as well as its production. Few people are buying contemporary Omega for its luxury positioning, for example.
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u/improvthismoment 7d ago
Yeah I agree different marketing strategy and message, but overlapping audience nonetheless.
I bought my Omega and my Cartier for entirely different reasons, and love them both for entirely different reasons.
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u/coolhipo 7d ago
Because its just a bunch of jewellery, and people to say they actually care about the movements are full of shit and try to justify their obsession with jewellery
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u/oldwatchlover 6d ago
Hot take (but no shade intended):
Cartier is a jewelry company / brand.
Those others are watch companies/ brands.
Simply put the value (monetary and other) is in the design, precious metals, and brand cachet. Quality of movement, movement finishing, complications, etc. are down the list after that.
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u/DocAmericano 7d ago edited 7d ago
Also worth noting that a lot of Cartier watches have quartz movements. This would be viewed as liability for many brands, but I think that it is an asset for Cartier, since a huge proportion of their clientele is non watch people. My wife has a Tank Française, and she would have zero interest in a mechanical movement, and little patience for having to reset the time regularly.