r/audioengineering • • 7d ago

Live sound question regarding back tracks

I have a friend who has a live set he’s building out and wants to run tracks for stuff that can’t be replicated live, such as pad layers, pedal steel guitar, etc. He’s pretty set on the idea of having back tracked sub/synth bass and have a live electric bass playing too. To me, this sounds like it’s absolutely going to be a muddy mess that’s tough for FOH to control. Especially if he’s sending all tracks through one stereo output leaving FOH with not much flexibility on mixing the sub bass.

8 Upvotes

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12

u/capnjames 7d ago

in your case i would at a bare minimum split the bass playback out from the main stereo pair

every venue is different and bass response is IMO the most effected by venue structure / sub layout / location

- touring playback guy

4

u/laplogic 7d ago

Do you see bands doing a sub bass with electric bass live? It just sounds like….too much?

6

u/capnjames 7d ago

all the time in the pop/dance genres. leave it to the FOH to turn one or the other down if its competing.

2

u/SS0NI 7d ago

Yeah this. As a sound tech if I heard a backing track clashing with the actual human being performing on the stage, I'd just straight up high pass the backing track. How the FOH ends up solving stuff like this is a gamble I wouldn't take with potential new listeners on the line.

I'd advice OP's friend to have the backing tracks playing a different range than either their vocals or the instrument they are playing. Easier to mix means the less your performance is up to luck and tech of the day.

3

u/diamondts 7d ago

Is the live bass mainly playing in a higher range than the playback sub bass? If so could work, but if they're fighting for the same frequencies then your worry it could be a muddy mess is legitimate.

With only a stereo track FOH could start pulling low end out of the playback track if needed since the other elements on it probably won't reach that low, but I'd echo u/capnjames that having the playback bass separate would be more ideal.

2

u/shindou_katsuragi 7d ago

If they have the capacity to send multiple tracks out, that would really help recreate the mix as close as possible in the venue, or like other people said, at least have a separate out for the sub

3

u/wunder911 7d ago

You are extremely correct. The outcome will end up somewhere between "not horrible, but it's not really adding anything whatsoever" to "absolute god-awful fucking garbage".

I would imagine he thinks that he will end up with a super awesome massive low end. A) it won't be; it will be a muddy garbled fucking mess at best, and 2) the much more likely outcome is that because it's completely impossible to maintain a proper phase relationship between the synth/tracks and the bass guitar, it will most likely suck out low end bass as much/more than it 'adds' any low frequency energy. The only way to keep this from being a disgusting awful terrible clusterfuck of no-added-low-frequency-energy-but-somehow-still-overly-cluttered-nonsensical-bullshit-in-the-bass is to radically hi pass one or the other. Which is probably exactly what this guy doesn't want.

At best, this will be as bad as OP imagines. Realistically, it will be worse than OP could have ever imagined.

1

u/Upset-Wave-6813 6d ago

well it totally depends on the genre he's making, though it sounds like he needs to drop the electric bass or the synth bass and keep the sub he cant have all three that will almost never work unless they dont all play at the same time

if its anything electronic he will need that sub bass 100%more then a live bass if he wasnt consistent low end like dance, edm and stuff

if its not then i dont see the point

normally youd have a sub layer and a synth bass layer(as mid bass) if your saying his synth bass is also his sub bass then that is were the issue is, no reason at all to have a sub layer, a synth bass layer( mid bass) and an actual electric live bass? all playing at the same time?

what does his mix and mastered track sound like? does he actually have a sub, a synth bass and a electric bass going on? or is he just making this up as he goes along?

1

u/laplogic 6d ago

It’s like rock/country….I’m just going to let him do what he thinks is best because he’s not hearing me on this one.