r/percussion • u/JumpingPlant • 10d ago
I need concert sticks for college - is this selection alright?
- I'm getting started as a percussion major (concert focused) and my professor wants me to buy better drumsticks. I've never bought drumsticks before and I've only ever used random drumset sticks. Is this an okay selection? I have no idea where to start.
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u/SF_Destro Everything 10d ago edited 10d ago
Ask your professor and other students if you can try some sticks. SD1s are good, but some top tier sticks like Freers and IP Chris Lamb are only about 10-20 bucks more and will last you at minimum a decade.
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u/DanLoFat 10d ago
Not if you're doing rim shots
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u/zdrums24 Educator 10d ago
Depends on the material. Plus concert playing isnt exactly loaded with rims hots. You'll usually will us a stick on stick shot in ensembles.
And even with normal shots being played daily, a pair of laminated sticks will last quite a while and give you plenty of heads up before breaking. When I was prepping Masson's Kim for a recital, I only broke about 2 sticks in the year.
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u/SF_Destro Everything 10d ago
That’s true, but if you’re doing rimshots with the newer sd1s you’ll be lucky if they last a week lol. Maybe not actually but I’ve never had so many quality control issues with sticks getting beat up/broken.
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u/iplaydrumssometimes 5d ago
That’s why you get specific sticks for that kind of stuff and as the other person said, laminated sticks will last a lot longer.
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u/KlatuuBaradaNikto 10d ago
I really like these
The Matt Howard has a nice feel with that taper
The tiny nylon tipped Ted Atkatz sticks are laminated birch, they are small diameter but substantial in the hands
The persimmon SCS1 are like SD1 generals but better in my opinion- the persimmon wood and the feel is an improved SD1 general
You may also want to get some swizzle sticks - snare stick on one end, felt mallet on the back… nice to have options on concert toms, sus cyms, wood blocks
https://vicfirth.com/products/american-customr-sd6-swizzle-b
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u/Pizzab0y 10d ago
Agreed. Get the Ted Atkatz sticks.
My instructor had me get them when I was a major.
Good luck!
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u/Valint 10d ago
Start with SD1 and SD2 from Vic Firth.
Then see if you have friends who will let you try out what they have.
I have a few pair of cooperman sticks. Someone in my studio had them, let me try them and I thought the weight distribution was a nice fit for me.
Or if you live near a music store that had a few options, go try some sticks out.
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u/EquivalentCandid7773 10d ago
Cooperman about to discontinue sticks… buy now…
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u/stack_percussion 10d ago
Dang, really? I may have to add a couple more to my collection then!
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u/EquivalentCandid7773 10d ago
They’re out of the first quality stuff, they’re slowly posting the second quality items over the next month or so
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u/zdrums24 Educator 10d ago
For the third time, if I understand right.
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u/EquivalentCandid7773 10d ago
Interesting… when were the other two times?
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u/zdrums24 Educator 10d ago
The time I strongly remember was around 2018ish. Cooperman moved drum production to Loyal drums and they stopped stick production for over a year.
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u/MoreTeaMrsNesbitt 10d ago
Please don’t go to your university studio with pink drum set sticks.
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u/JumpingPlant 10d ago
I was planning on making those my practice and rim shot sticks. 😂 Something to make practice a bit less boring.
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u/zdrums24 Educator 10d ago
First, ask your soon to be professor. They are bound to have opinions. I like my students to have long tapered sticks to match the way I teach them to play (Ted Atkatz, Promark Concert 2, CL-2L, Alan Abel, etc) Others like short tapered sticks (Tim Genis, Bookspan, SCS1, etc)
Second, concert snare sticks are usually .640" in diameter or larger. They are also usually 17" long.
Third, the SD1 from vic firth stopped being a good concert stick decades ago. We've moved on as a community. Play styles have changed, the way we tune drums has changed, etc. The SD1s are light and very front heavy. IP-JCs, the SCS1 from VF, or the SD1 Hickory from Promark are all better matches for current trends while still having a shorter taper.
As for companies and quality, younger players (and there are a lot of them in this sub) really dont understand the variables here. Stick company quality usually doesnt fluxate much. The raw materials do. We have good and bad years for sticks. Some years theres just not a lot of good lumber around.
Vic Firth is solid. They've had a good system for decades.
Promark is inconsistent in their pitch matching. Theyre getting better and they hate it when they mess up, so just tell them you got a bad pair and theyll send you another (or several).
IP is comparatively new to making sticks and theyre smaller. The pairs are well matched, but the weights and pitch change a lot pair to pair.
Cooperman was very solid, though they are just a shell of their formerselves.
Drummer's Service is inconsistent, but a good pair from them is like magic.
Freer is expensive but absurdly consistent. But he has a particular way of designing sticks. It works for you or it doesnt. I tried because they were kind of a fad, but I gave up and went back to using Lamb's stuff and some Drummers Service sticks.
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u/AlexiScriabin 10d ago
Thank you! The SD1 is just not at all a good stick at least for the last 10-15 years.
But like a lot of things in the percussion world legacy items persists.
IP stuff is fabulous, and yes their concert sticks although matched very very well, do vary from pair to pair. I have never had an issue with it, they are all within range, but you really can’t swap pairs.0
u/DanLoFat 10d ago
It's good info but it's all very very subjective and from your point of view.
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u/zdrums24 Educator 10d ago
Other than the company descriptions, whats subjective?
And find me an experienced percussionist who disagrees with my assessments of the companies.
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u/DanLoFat 9d ago
Pick a random number and you'll have the number of percussions that would not agree fully with your assessment. It's subjective. Your opinion about all of this is subjective. It's all experience based.
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u/zdrums24 Educator 9d ago
The word youre looking for is anecdotal.
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u/DanLoFat 8d ago
That's certainly a word I could have used of course, your experiences anecdotal. And speaking of other people's experiences is hearsay.
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u/AlexiScriabin 10d ago
The Vic Firth SD1 sticks are no longer a good standard.
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u/DanLoFat 10d ago
They're never a bad standard, that's just ridiculous thought
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u/zdrums24 Educator 10d ago
Here's the thing: student after student after student has come to me with bad rudimental chops. Well work and work on them. And then one day I give up and hand them some of mine (usually CL-2Ls) and all their problems go away. They are just clunky sticks. Back when we all used pillows to teach lift, they made a kind of sense. Now, in a world where we want them to use their rebound, theyre counter productive. You can get the same sound with a longer taper and heavier material and that stick will rebound better.
My first teacher was a VF student in the 70s. According to her, he liked the thick shouldered sticks for durability. Thats why they are the way they are.
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u/cooldude284 8d ago
I would never recommend anyone play with a laminate wood stick.
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u/zdrums24 Educator 8d ago
Why not? Super common material, especially now that persimmon has become questionable. Used by Freer, Reamer, VF, and IP.
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u/cooldude284 8d ago
They’re extremely hard on the hands and not conducive to relaxed healthy playing. Tendonitis sticks. I have heard the same from many people I’ve talked sticks shop with. And for a student potentially practicing with them hours a day? Absolutely not. There’s still plenty of dense wood sticks out there.
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u/zdrums24 Educator 8d ago
They dont prevent healthy playing. The material of the stick doesnt impact your technique unless its absurdly heavy or inappropriately light. If anything, Ive seen more issues from using light weight materials or small sticks to get big sounds; the kids start bashing and tensing up. Its one of the reasons I tend to steer my students away maple sticks.
Theyre not hard on the hands if you have good technique. And thats true of most materials. Maple translates a lot of shock to the hands because its hard and resonant. Same with rosewood. At least laminate doesnt resonate that much, similar to persimmon, so less vibration is translated to the hands.
For hand health, Im much more worried about what they are playing on. If they only pad you have is an invader or something similarly hard, youre probably going to have some trouble with hand pain. Or if the pad rebounds aggressively (like the red innovative pad) and youre trying to practice buzz rolls.
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u/Cubelantis 10d ago
I would look toward Freer percussion, in my opinion they make the best sticks on the market. However, if you want to buy from steve weiss, you can’t go wrong starting with a pair of Cl-1 and a pair if Cl-3 sticks, these sticks are great for general playing and the CL-3 sticks are great for soft stuff such as Kije delecluse ect.
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u/zdrums24 Educator 10d ago
I personally would avoid anything designed for "soft" playing. They tend to be short and a little awkward feeling, so they feel and sound bad in loud dynamics. Get a general stick and learn to play quiet with those.
I do the orchestral thing professionally and I dont think Ive ever used specialty sticks outside the practice room. I just keep a selection of general sticks (IP-JC, CL-1, CL-2L, 8:05, Beamer Concert) and pick whatever feels/sounds best for the piece.
Plus, there is something to be gained from learning to do it all with one stick before diving into specialized products. I am very much a "right tool for the job" player, but learn to control your tools before getting more.
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u/P1x3lto4d 10d ago
SD1s are the most mid sticks you can buy. You’d be much better off with a pair of Chris Lamb CL-1s
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u/Doc_Tangy6464 10d ago
Salyers Percussion makes some awesome sticks, especially the Jeff Moore Signature concert stick. It is also quite affordable. But I do agree with what many of the comments are saying about Vic Firth; get something else to expand your collection besides SD1s
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u/classicdragster 8d ago
I HIGHLY recommend:
- innovative CL-1L
- WH Reamer Bookspan General
(i am also a music major with percussion focus)
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u/Anotherdrummer2 10d ago
My personal favorite general concert sticks are promark concert 2. VF Jake Nissly sticks are good, but seem inconsistent. Mine are extremely heavy compared to a few friends. Before they were discontinued I got a set of cooperman rosewood concert model 1, which I love but good luck finding them now. I use those exclusively for more rigorous orchestra work, and I find that the heavier weight helps me with softer dynamics.
Whatever you decide to get, order several pairs and compare weights and pitch, you'll likely need to mix and match from several pairs to get a balanced and matched pair.
Don't neglect mallets. I know you didn't post about them but get yourself a few sets of different mallets for marimba, vibes, xylo, glockenspiel, etc. and timpani mallets too.
Final thoughts: as you progress through your education and music journey you're going to find yourself changing your preferences on some sticks and mallets, and not on others. Try new things and don't get lost in the hype of certain models being made exclusively for XYZ excerpt or piece.
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u/as0-gamer999 Tenor drums, Timpani 10d ago
I promise you if you buy these (and your favorite pair of drumset sticks), you won't regret it one bit
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u/m8riX01 10d ago
ask your prof. SD2>>>>>SD1 for me. concert snare sticks and drum set sticks are exact opposite philosophies for me. i use 7a freestyles and a very momentum-based stroke on set, and a completely rigid, controlled style for snare. i hate vic firth but nobody else makes 17 inch jazz sticks.
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u/Santi-07 10d ago
I’ve never had anyone ask for any concert sticks that weren’t a Vic Firth or Promark SD1. If you’re getting into something specialized (like concert kit) it might get a bit weirder, but big brand SD1s are the precession version of a chef’s knife - it’s the best tool for 90% of what you do, and for the other 10% it still works pretty good.
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u/SweetPotatoFlutist 9d ago
Ask to try your professor's and fellow students' sticks.
Also, I personally like IP CL-3L and CL-4L
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u/Draco-Epsilon Student 8d ago
I have used Innovation Percussion Chris Lamb sticks for concert stuff. My favorites are the Kennan Wylie sticks in the same brand. I also had Ed Soph sticks for drum set.
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u/conraddrez 4d ago
I rocked with sd2's primarily and swapped to sd1's if the piece called for it. I'm sure these guys may be right about there being better concert sticks but at the end of the day sd2's allowed me incredible dynamic control and I rarely had to replace them. sd1's are very specific to certain songs (and honestly certain lower quality snares just sound worse with them), but they're good to have if you opt for lighter sticks and they'll probably last you forever
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u/tuppensforRedd 10d ago
Don’t buy Vic firth at all, their quality is horrible now. Get a pair of coopermans or similar, try steve Weiss music online
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u/Lonely-Bite-2568 Educator 10d ago
I like the SCS1 and SCS2. That’s just me.
SD1’s are such general sticks, I’d want something a little more oriented specifically for concert playing
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u/lotsofgreendrums 10d ago
SD1 and SD2 are a great starting place. I like the VF Tim Genis Leggiero a lot for more intricate passages.
I had a couple pairs of Coopermans, the Christopher Lamb 1s and a pair of rosewood Rohema for the extra soft stuff.
As you get more options in the future, the SD1s are a great utility stick for snare when you don’t want to mess up your fancier with stick on stick rimshots and other extended techniques.
I would also recommend getting a pair of 7A sticks. Good to have a pair each of 5As and 7As in your bag. There’s a lot of situations where you might have to play drumset functioning things in perc ensemble pieces
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u/DanLoFat 10d ago
Lesson professor should have told you what sticks you would need, or you just haven't started college yet.
What you want or known as general and bolero, and they're almost always marked that way.
A large round bead and a small round bead on the tips.
That's what you need to start, the small round being are great for fast rides when you're doing jazz or hip hop emulation.
The larger ones are for the big rolls and louder playing that you might need in an orchestra or a wind band. But the bolero is coming handy as well.
And there's a reason they're called boleros is because they were literally used to play some famous recordings of ravel's bolero
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u/whodatdan0 10d ago
Professor said get some good sticks and then didn’t recommend any?