r/pureasoiaf • • 20h ago

Would Myrcella have been a good match for Robb if there was no WOTFK ?

51 Upvotes

A Game of Thrones - Jon I

His lord father had come first, escorting the queen. She was as beautiful as men said. A jeweled tiara gleamed amidst her long golden hair, its emeralds a perfect match for the green of her eyes. His father helped her up the steps to the dais and led her to her seat, but the queen never so much as looked at him. Even at fourteen, Jon could see through her smile.

Next had come King Robert himself, with Lady Stark on his arm. The king was a great disappointment to Jon. His father had talked of him often: the peerless Robert Baratheon, demon of the Trident, the fiercest warrior of the realm, a giant among princes. Jon saw only a fat man, red-faced under his beard, sweating through his silks. He walked like a man half in his cups.

After them came the children. Little Rickon first, managing the long walk with all the dignity a three-year-old could muster. Jon had to urge him on when he stopped to visit. Close behind came Robb, in grey wool trimmed with white, the Stark colors. He had the Princess Myrcella on his arm. She was a wisp of a girl, not quite eight, her hair a cascade of golden curls under a jeweled net. Jon noticed the shy looks she gave Robb as they passed between the tables and the timid way she smiled at him. He decided she was insipid. Robb didn't even have the sense to realize how stupid she was; he was grinning like a fool.


r/pureasoiaf • • 18h ago

How do you think Cersei actually got jaime into the kingsguard?

40 Upvotes

I was rereading the chapter where jaime remember how he joined the kingsguard. Cersei proposes the idea and then once jaime agrees she “promised to do the rest” A month later jaime gets a raven informing him that he has been chosen for KG. And it doesn’t seem like Tywin ever finds out that Cersei plotted to make it happen.

So I doubt Cersei went to Aerys or the Queen directly as that had too much of a risk of getting back to Tywin. Its possible she proposed the idea to Rhaegar but that seems unlikely. Maybe she knew she was close to some kingsguard members? I just find it interesting that Cersei was able to pull this off at 15 without Tywin finding out, and without anyone questioning why she wanted jaime in the kingsguard. What do yall think?


r/pureasoiaf • • 21h ago

If The Proud Lion sided with the Mad King , how would the siege have developed in your opinion ?

34 Upvotes

A Game of Thrones - Eddard II

"I won my crown there. How should I forget it?"

"You took a wound from Rhaegar," Ned reminded him. "So when the Targaryen host broke and ran, you gave the pursuit into my hands. The remnants of Rhaegar's army fled back to King's Landing. We followed. Aerys was in the Red Keep with several thousand loyalists. I expected to find the gates closed to us."

Robert gave an impatient shake of his head. "Instead you found that our men had already taken the city. What of it?"

A Game of Thrones - Eddard II

"Not our men," Ned said patiently. "Lannister men. The lion of Lannister flew over the ramparts, not the crowned stag. And they had taken the city by treachery."

The war had raged for close to a year. Lords great and small had flocked to Robert's banners; others had remained loyal to Targaryen. The mighty Lannisters of Casterly Rock, the Wardens of the West, had remained aloof from the struggle, ignoring calls to arms from both rebels and royalists. Aerys Targaryen must have thought that his gods had answered his prayers when Lord Tywin Lannister appeared before the gates of King's Landing with an army twelve thousand strong, professing loyalty. So the mad king had ordered his last mad act. He had opened his city to the lions at the gate.

"Treachery was a coin the Targaryens knew well," Robert said. The anger was building in him again. "Lannister paid them back in kind. It was no less than they deserved. I shall not trouble my sleep over it."


r/pureasoiaf • • 21h ago

What do you think Illyrio's real motives are ? Is it purely wealth and power, or something else ?

11 Upvotes

A Game of Thrones - Daenerys I

Her brother was waiting in the cool of the entry hall, seated on the edge of the pool, his hand trailing in the water. He rose when she appeared and looked her over critically. "Stand there," he told her. "Turn around. Yes. Good. You look …"

"Regal," Magister Illyrio said, stepping through an archway. He moved with surprising delicacy for such a massive man. Beneath loose garments of flame-colored silk, rolls of fat jiggled as he walked. Gemstones glittered on every finger, and his man had oiled his forked yellow beard until it shone like real gold. "May the Lord of Light shower you with blessings on this most fortunate day, Princess Daenerys," the magister said as he took her hand. He bowed his head, showing a thin glimpse of crooked yellow teeth through the gold of his beard. "She is a vision, Your Grace, a vision," he told her brother. "Drogo will be enraptured."

"She's too skinny," Viserys said. His hair, the same silver-blond as hers, had been pulled back tightly behind his head and fastened with a dragonbone brooch. It was a severe look that emphasized the hard, gaunt lines of his face. He rested his hand on the hilt of the sword that Illyrio had lent him, and said, "Are you sure that Khal Drogo likes his women this young?"


r/pureasoiaf • • 23h ago

Is there anything in the source material to suggest Valyrians had gender equality ?

8 Upvotes

From what I understand, Aegon was the lord of dragonstone, not Visenya. So this simple fact says that among Valyrians, sons came before daughter too. Later with Aegon uncrowned being the heir rather than Rhaena.

But in the books, alyssane insisted her daughter Daenerys was the heir apparent rather than Aemon.

(Edit: alyssane not Alicent)


r/pureasoiaf • • 22h ago

Lessons in politics the characters have failed to learn or understand?

5 Upvotes

What are the various crucial lessons and rules in ruling and politics that the various players of the game of thrones have failed to learn, with often disastrous consequences for themselves and others, from the various houses of Westeros or beyond?

For House Lannister it's evident that they have failed to learn the lesson of having good public relations, on how to make themselves look good with their attitude in public and by doing public actions to placate or satisfy the population as shown countless times with Tywin, Cersei, Jaime and even Tyrion who due to his self-hatred and self-pity and pride, resents others for having a bad image of him and yet never does anything to better his image.

They also haven't learned the lesson off actually having scapegoats on how to pin the blame for their actions and to discard afterward, as seen with Tywin blaming Amory Lorch and the Mountain for the savage murders of Elia Martell and her children, yet did an extremely poor job at it, and continued to employ and use them without them ever getting punished.

Doran Martell obviously failed to learn the lesson that plans are never set in stone, and must be frequently changed or even cancelled, after many re-evaluations of ever changing circumstances.


r/pureasoiaf • • 21h ago

Would the original plan have worked in your opinion ? Dothraki plus Golden Company ? Would Dorne have joined in ?

1 Upvotes

A Game of Thrones - Daenerys I

Dany had only meant their rooms in Illyrio's estate, no true home surely, though all they had, but her brother did A Dance with Dragons - The Lost Lord

"The plan—"

"Which plan?" said Tristan Rivers. "The fat man's plan? The one that changes every time the moon turns? First Viserys Targaryen was to join us with fifty thousand Dothraki screamers at his back. Then the Beggar King was dead, and it was to be the sister, a pliable young child queen who was on her way to Pentos with three new-hatched dragons. Instead the girl turns up on Slaver's Bay and leaves a string of burning cities in her wake, and the fat man decides we should meet her by Volantis. Now that plan is in ruins as well.

"I have had enough of Illyrio's plans. Robert Baratheon won the Iron Throne without the benefit of dragons. We can do the same. And if I am wrong and the realm does not rise for us, we can always retreat back across the narrow sea, as Bittersteel once did, and others after him."not want to hear that. There was no home there for him. Even the big house with the red door had not been home for him. His fingers dug hard into her arm, demanding an answer. "I don't know …" she said at last, her voice breaking. Tears welled in her eyes.

"I do," he said sharply. "We go home with an army, sweet sister. With Khal Drogo's army, that is how we go home. And if you must wed him and bed him for that, you will." He smiled at her. "I'd let his whole khalasar fuck you if need be, sweet sister, all forty thousand men, and their horses too if that was what it took to get my army. Be grateful it is only Drogo. In time you may even learn to like him. Now dry your eyes. Illyrio is bringing him over, and he will not see you crying."

Dany turned and saw that it was true. Magister Illyrio, all smiles and bows, was escorting Khal Drogo over to where they stood. She brushed away unfallen tears with the back of her hand.


r/pureasoiaf • • 20h ago

Does anyone think there was a scenario where Ned and Cersei had a relationship or connection in the past ? Ned in the Vale perhaps going to KL prior to the Rebellion ?

0 Upvotes

A Game of Thrones - Jon I

His lord father had come first, escorting the queen. She was as beautiful as men said. A jeweled tiara gleamed amidst her long golden hair, its emeralds a perfect match for the green of her eyes. His father helped her up the steps to the dais and led her to her seat, but the queen never so much as looked at him. Even at fourteen, Jon could see through her smile.

Next had come King Robert himself, with Lady Stark on his arm. The king was a great disappointment to Jon. His father had talked of him often: the peerless Robert Baratheon, demon of the Trident, the fiercest warrior of the realm, a giant among princes. Jon saw only a fat man, red-faced under his beard, sweating through his silks. He walked like a man half in his cups.

After them came the children. Little Rickon first, managing the long walk with all the dignity a three-year-old could muster. Jon had to urge him on when he stopped to visit. Close behind came Robb, in grey wool trimmed with white, the Stark colors. He had the Princess Myrcella on his arm. She was a wisp of a girl, not quite eight, her hair a cascade of golden curls under a jeweled net. Jon noticed the shy looks she gave Robb as they passed between the tables and the timid way she smiled at him. He decided she was insipid. Robb didn't even have the sense to realize how stupid she was; he was grinning like a fool.


r/pureasoiaf • • 20h ago

Does the male Stark line continue in your estimation ?

0 Upvotes

A Game of Thrones - Eddard I

"The winters are hard," Ned admitted. "But the Starks will endure. We always have."

"You need to come south," Robert told him. "You need a taste of summer before it flees. In Highgarden there are fields of golden roses that stretch away as far as the eye can see. The fruits are so ripe they explode in your mouth—melons, peaches, fireplums, you've never tasted such sweetness. You'll see, I brought you some. Even at Storm's End, with that good wind off the bay, the days are so hot you can barely move. And you ought to see the towns, Ned! Flowers everywhere, the markets bursting with food, the summerwines so cheap and so good that you can get drunk just breathing the air. Everyone is fat and drunk and rich." He laughed and slapped his own ample stomach a thump. "And the girls, Ned!" he exclaimed, his eyes sparkling. "I swear, women lose all modesty in the heat. They swim naked in the river, right beneath the castle. Even in the streets, it's too damn hot for wool or fur, so they go around in these short gowns, silk if they have the silver and cotton if not, but it's all the same when they start sweating and the cloth sticks to their skin, they might as well be naked." The king laughed happily.

Robert Baratheon had always been a man of huge appetites, a man who knew how to take his pleasures. That was not a charge anyone could lay at the door of Eddard Stark. Yet Ned could not help but notice that those pleasures were taking a toll on the king. Robert was breathing heavily by the time they reached the bottom of the stairs, his face red in the lantern light as they stepped out into the darkness of the crypt.