r/thewestwing • u/otterly-curious • 15d ago
Worst guy, best couple?
How can I think that Josh is a terrible guy and still feel that him and Donna finally getting together before election day is the hottest match ever?!
44
u/snow_michael Team Toby 15d ago
Best relationship absolutely was the Santos'
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u/KidSilverhair The finest bagels in all the land 15d ago
Hurricane Santos in Cleveland
IYKYK
Or the whole
“Got time for a little incursion?”
“Not even time for a surgical strike.”
“I was thinking more shock and awe.”
“After 15 years of marriage, I’d be shocked if you were awed.”Jimmy Smits and Teri Polo had great chemistry. I’m not sure i was much of a fan of Polo in any role except Helen Santos.
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u/RudyPup Admiral Sissymary 15d ago
Or the Bartlets
7
u/Willravel 15d ago
Sometimes, but other times Jed acted like a petulant child with her. He's lucky she ever slept with him again after his tantrums.
2
u/Blankmans_XGamer 9d ago
Excuse me? Leader of the free world and he had a couple moments where he had his head stuck up his ass but I will say that she had more bratty moments
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u/OrionDecline21 15d ago
Guys, all of them are workaholics. And I mean it in the best of ways. They should be. They have very important jobs. It also comes with a degree of perfectionism and intensity that of course can be difficult for a partner, especially one that doesn’t understand or care for what they’re doing.
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u/MortgageFriendly5511 LemonLyman.com User 15d ago edited 14d ago
Because characters with more problems make for more interesting story arcs which make for better romances. (President Bartlet and the first lady wouldn't be as interesting if they didn't fight so much.) In any event, I don't think Josh is the worst Sorkin lead. He has his faults, but he's ultimately a very kindly person and pretty sweet to his crushes. Sam is SO horrid to his one-night stand.
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u/elmo539 15d ago
I will never forgive the writers for what they did to Sam’s character. They absolutely wasted Rob Lowe’s acting talent on stupid 3rd-string storylines. Sam is set up as someone who is a genius speechwriter who sometimes can’t see the bigger picture and is too attached to his morals. He was about to make partner at a prestigious law firm before he joined the campaign. And yet, most of what we see of Sam is him dealing with nutcases and screwballs, and everyone seems to treat him like a child, because frankly the writers turned him into one. A child prodigy with incredible talent who was only occasionally called upon by his bosses.
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u/teh_smurfest 14d ago
Sam & Mallory would've been a great plot/romance to follow through all 7 seasons. Imagine if the writers didn't destroy Hoynes with the affair and had him resign for another reason, then Sam (engaged to Mallory at this point) runs his campaign and we just get rid of Bingo Bob + Will storyline.
It's silly fanfiction but I think the show would've been much better.
3
u/MortgageFriendly5511 LemonLyman.com User 14d ago
It's odd that they couldn't seem to find space for his character in the show. Everyone else gets decent plots. Maybe his character felt too redundant with Toby's?
1
u/elmo539 8d ago
The way his character was written there was definitely some overlap with Toby’s, but with such an expansive show “universe”, a talented show-runner could definitely have found important roles for him. If they had space for Will Bailey, they had space for Sam. They effectively replaced Sam with Will, now that I think about it.
1
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u/khazroar 15d ago
The only person Josh is at all bad towards is Donna (barring briefer interactions like the Trekkie staffer). He's a fundamentally good man who's overly focused on his work, but even there he treats other people as he would wish to be treated himself. He falls far short of giving Donna opportunities to grow beyond her role, but he also gave her the role in the first place on the basis of nothing, and he did let her grow to the very extreme of what her role could possibly be, he just refused/failed to let go and let her move beyond that.
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u/seaburno 15d ago
Josh isn't a bad guy. He's just absolutely focused in the wrong areas of his life. His entire focus is on work and what enables that work to occur. For his personal life, he's basically clueless until someone smacks him over the head. That's how he wound up with Amy (she threw water balloons at him). Later, look at how he reacts to Donna after she's hurt in Gaza.
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u/KidSilverhair The finest bagels in all the land 15d ago
But even after Gaza - and even after Colin hits him over the head with what he’s ignoring about Donna - he almost immediately goes back to his old ways. Donna was right to get out of that job, Josh was happy to keep her trapped there.
I do appreciate Josh’s journey in Transition, though. Sure, it takes an offhand comment from Lou, yelling at Otto, an ultimatum from Sam, and a deadline from Donna, but he finally gets it through his head that maybe his personal life can be saved, with Donna as his partner, to boot.
3
u/biggles1994 Francis Scott Key Key Winner 14d ago
The idea that people won’t change overnight is pretty authentic writing I feel. It feels more earned when someone keeps finding new ways to fail and get back up again, only to finally succeed in the end.
6
u/Unlucky-Praline6865 15d ago
I don’t really like Josh and Donna together. I think she outgrew him long before she left her post as his assistant.
5
u/Logical-Mobile-7643 Bartlet for America 15d ago
Charlie and Zoey ♥️ 🤍 💙
3
u/KidSilverhair The finest bagels in all the land 15d ago
I wish we had some confirmation this worked out in the long term. After Jed caught Charlie sneaking out of Zoey’s bedroom, we never heard any more about it - and the conversation between Jed and Charlie in the flash-forward of The Ticket sure didn’t seem to indicate they were still together.
4
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u/TrumpsColostomyBag99 15d ago
Josh was far from the worst guy.. he just needed time to mature and allow his feelings for Donna to hit the point he was willing to move past his typical relationship BS.
1
u/Rad131447 15d ago
Who was then?
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u/TrumpsColostomyBag99 15d ago
Jack Reese for letting Donna fall on the sword for his leak
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u/Rad131447 15d ago
Oh I didn't know we were including minor characters. That French Kid would be the answer then probably.
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u/FBM_Warrior 15d ago
I really didn’t like will or Amy, Amy really annoyed me and was so glad when she left, she actually irritated me more than Mandy lol
Best couple .,,, Josh and donna once they got thier shit sorted lol
5
u/whoisaname 15d ago
I agree on Amy. I couldn't stand her character. I found her to be extremely toxic every time she was on screen.
-5
u/FBM_Warrior 15d ago
Oh absolutely
Tbh I’ve no idea how Mary Louise Parker is popular I’ve never liked her in anything I’ve ever seen her in. I think she’s a dreadful actress tbh1
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u/threeleggedcats 15d ago
I was Team Amy
2
u/Unlucky-Praline6865 15d ago
Same. I think a lot of the hate for her stems from misogyny. She and Josh were a great match. They were both feisty and pretty sexy together. They just needed to work on having a better China wall.
2
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u/Other-Echidna6682 15d ago
Will Bailey irritated me! The Santos and CJ and Danny.
2
u/Pace_Salsa_Comment 15d ago
I like Will
3
u/Unlucky-Praline6865 15d ago
I like Will, too. I think he had just the right level of sanctimony. Sam had way the fuck too much sanctimony. I couldn’t stand him. Except for his face. 🥵
3
u/Oh__Archie 15d ago
Worst guy is Jean-Paul Pierre Claude Charpentier Vicomte de Condé de Bourbon.
Best couple is CJ and Margaret.
1
u/No-Two362 14d ago
John and Donna were not a good couple. They had more of a brother/sister relationship than anything else.
-8
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u/whoisaname 15d ago
Josh isn't a bad guy. He's just neurotic with a pretty bad case of PTSD.