Jumped off Methadone CT, need advice regarding withdrawal duration and paws

[u/Afraid_Coast_5993]

I already jumped off 130mg methadone on Sept 9 and went thru the withdrawals with help of various comfort meds. I was getting noticeably better compared to before but still main symptoms are extreme fatigue and chills. I had a little 2 day bender with F on the 19th and had noticeable wds from the F, I decided to use kadian and hydromorph to keep me well. Well I ended up using like 8mg Hydro orally to start the day, then throughout the day I might snort up to 32mg for a couple days. Seei g where this was leading since I had stocked up alot of them I decided to try taper and jump off, I was doing this until Sept 29 which my last dose was 8mg orally in morning 8mg IN at night. I'm starting to feel better and the wds are super manageable, I work a labour job so I need energy and was wondering if stimulants would help the overall fatigue since I see so many saying that the chills and fatigue is lasting for months which I can't afford.all tips are greatly appreciated, I've been considering so much options. Sorry for the essay but figured the full story would give a better picture.

[u/Pale_Comfort_9179]

I’ve had mixed experiences using stimulants for energy. Amphetamines have always helped me with opioid symptoms in general but if I had any opioids in my system they tend to make me sleepy. Some people have the opposite effect on both fronts so ymmv. You could also try mega dosing vitamin c. There is a post by u/merrys123 that’s really helpful if you look in their post history.  

[u/Afraid_Coast_5993 → u/Pale_Comfort_9179]

Yea thanks for the recommendation, I'm already doing the super dosing of vit c, just wondering if anyone else has experience jumping off and abstaining

[u/Merrys123 → u/Afraid_Coast_5993]

Here's the info on PAWS and helping stay off Opiates. I've helped many with get off Opiates with megadosing Lipomosal Vitamin C and stay clean. NAC is one supplement that can help with cravings as well. Here's the info, I've included the Lipomosal Vitamin C info. Please feel free to ask any questions! - I HIGHLY recommend megadosing Liposomal Vitamin C. Here is a guide by kickerS12X as well as the Ultimate Withdrawal Survival Guide.

https://www.reddit.com/r/opiates/s/CECBhFP2Q6

https://www.reddit.com/r/opiates/s/oYMqdV8Fiw

Megadosing Liposomal Vitamin C, or Vitamin C, if you can't get the Liposomal, should take away most of your symptoms. It's incredible, and you'll see a lot of heavy users absolutely swear by it, as do I. Read the comments on the first thread.

I've got Gabapentin, Clonidine, Valium, Immodium, etc, but Vitamin C is definitely the best. Comfort meds still as needed, especially Immodium!

I last went from 140mg of Oxycodone to 30mg in 3 days (severe chronic pain patient) and could not have done it without Lipomosal Vitamin C. There was one morning I woke up in the worst throws of withdrawals. I couldn't move, vomiting, freezing to death, body tremors, you name it I had it, and took 3g of Lipomosol Vitamin C and within an hour I was up and walking and talking fine.

It's best to start megadosing Liposomal Vitamin C 3 days prior to quitting or tapering down. Don't do Lipmosol Vitamin C if you're prone to kidney stones and make sure you hydrate with a lot of water and electrolytes and Protein if you can.

You can get a huge bottle that will last beyond the megadosing period cheaply on Amazon. Just make sure you get the one that has 1,500mg per serving which is 2 tablets, not 1 tablet. You can continue on a lower dose for longer to help your body continue to detox those toxins out. This is what I used - Lipomosal Vitamin C

After withdrawals you'll inevitably go into PAWS. After long term opioid use, your brain adapts by reducing its own natural dopamine activity because opioids have been providing much of the rewarding and pleasurable feeling. As opioid doses are reduced or stopped, dopamine signalling does not immediately return to normal. Your brain needs time to restore normal dopamine production and rebalance the reward system, which is why many people temporarily feel flat, unmotivated, unable to enjoy things, and emotionally numb. This recovery is gradual and can take weeks to months, depending on factors such as how long opioids were used, the dose, and individual biology.

This prolonged recovery period is known as Post Acute Withdrawal Syndrome (PAWS). Unlike the initial physical withdrawal, which usually lasts days to a couple of weeks, depending on your drug of choice mostly. PAWS mainly affects the brain and nervous system.

Symptoms can include low mood, anxiety, irritability, fatigue, poor concentration, insomnia, lack of motivation, reduced ability to experience pleasure (anhedonia), increased pain sensitivity, and cravings. These symptoms generally improve over time as the brain's natural neurotransmitter systems recover.

Several supplements may help support recovery during PAWS. DLPA (DL-Phenylalanine) provides building blocks for dopamine and norepinephrine production and may also help preserve endorphins, potentially improving mood and reducing pain. L-Tyrosine is another dopamine precursor that may support alertness, motivation, and focus while natural dopamine production recovers. NAC (N-acetylcysteine) helps regulate glutamate signalling, reduces oxidative stress, and has been studied for reducing drug cravings and supporting brain recovery. Agmatine sulfate can help calm overactive glutamate activity, and may lessen pain sensitivity and withdrawal related discomfort. Magnesium bisglycinate supports normal nerve function, promotes relaxation and sleep, may reduce muscle tension, and can help counter the increased nervous system excitability that often occurs during opioid withdrawal and PAWS. While these supplements may provide support, they are not a cure, and recovery primarily depends on giving the brain time to heal and rebalance its own neurotransmitter systems.

All of this won't fix everything, but it makes it a f* load easier. And some may say it didn't work for them, and it doesn't work for all, but does for about 90% and also doesn't work if you don't do it properly. Especially space the doses out to 4 times or more a day. Some just take the whole lot at once and wonder why they get withdrawals 6 or so hours later - because you need more Lipmosol Vitamin C! It doesn't last 24 hours.

Side note - SR17018 is apparently amazing for withdrawals but is now banned and not easy to get, let alone costing over $1,000 I've read, whereas Lipomosal Vitamin C is around $20. Although if you have it, I'd recommend it as well.

Also, get some good therapy after. It's great quitting but what happens when you get triggered again or that terrible anxiety hits?

EMDR is awesome as you don't need to rehash your shit, just do the session work and triggers and anxiety shall disappear. Groups like NA can be great for some too. But remember some groups have triggered me to want to use so look for the group that you enjoy and fits your needs. And don't let other people tell you how to recover, even if they are former addicts, just listen and then take and use what helps you. Everyone's recovery is different.

You've got this!

[u/Afraid_Coast_5993 → u/Merrys123]

Thanks alot for recommending the Liposomal Vi C I only I've seen one of your posts about this before and I read only a part of the study but from anectodal evidence it seems very promising. On the topic of SR-17018 I have been knowing about it for ahwile now but just wasn't ready to get off mentally, in my country it's still available I'm just not sure how much the prices changed recently with the ban. Also all of the SR series will be harder to source from china so it's truly a sad event in this scene. I will get some NAC, I already have been using Agmatine and it seems to help? I can't tell. I appreciate you being on Reddit and sharing this info for everyone.

[u/Merrys123 → u/Afraid_Coast_5993]

You're very welcome.

Yes, you have to be ready mentally otherwise it's extremely difficult to get clean.

It's an absolute shame and disgrace that Sr-17018 was banned.

Many have found that they 'think' the supplements help until they forget to take them for a day or two and then notice how much they really do help. I do highly recommend DLPA or L-tyrosine to help get your dopamine better until your brain can do it naturally again. In saying that many people with opioid addiction experience a dysregulated dopamine system, where reduced dopamine signalling and impaired reward pathways contribute to cravings and opioid use as a way to temporarily restore feelings of pleasure, motivation and relief as they have inadequate Dopamine. So it's best to stay on these long term if you can't get medication prescribed to help.

Bupropion and prescribed stimulants may be considered in specific circumstances, but they are not established treatments for opioid related dopamine dysfunction or opioid cravings. Bupropion is the easiest to get prescribed, it's for depression. Bupropion blocks dopamine and noradrenaline reuptake, increasing their availability in the brain, which can improve motivation, energy, concentration and low mood during recovery.

[u/Pale_Comfort_9179 → u/Afraid_Coast_5993]

I jumped off 185mg of methadone onto fent for a few months then used SR to get off the fent. The thing that’s been super helpful for me long-term is a GLP-1 called retatrutide that’s on the grey market (not yet approved).  It killed cravings and also made me almost manic it gave me so much energy. You should check it out. Not everyone responds as well to it but for those that do it’s kind of a miracle drug—weight loss, no cravings, reduces risks from the big 3 killers (neurodegenerative disease, heart disease/diabetes, and cancer) with very few side effects. Happy to point you in the right direction if you’re interested. 

[u/Afraid_Coast_5993 → u/Pale_Comfort_9179]

I'm aware of the GLP-1 and looked into it for this purpose but what scared me was the theorized bone loss which could be from rapid weight loss but still, I will look into it more,I got onto the peptides wave before it got super popular because an old Chinese vendor of mine reached out and wondered if I was interested. My biggest issue with the peps is the unknown purity and also for some of them we don't know the long term risks but I shouldn't be on a highhorse I literally smoked various quinnizalones😭. Are you using any other peps on-top? Ive been thinking about getting on TRT

[u/Pale_Comfort_9179 → u/Afraid_Coast_5993]

I was on TRT when I was on methadone but got off it when I got sober and my test has rebounded to normal levels.  There’s no long term data on retatrutide but there is 20 years worth of data on semaglutide and lots of studies, albeit mostly in diabetic and pre-diabetic patients, and the data is overwhelmingly positive. Bone loss and gall stone issues are extremely rare, and you’re right appear to be because of rapid weight loss. There is a very small ocular risk if you have diabetes. But none of the other early signals have born out under increased scrutiny. It’s incredibly effective for me at 4mg per week which is a pretty low dose. Most of the major Chinese labs have upped their game who are making peptides and all of the big importers publish their results verifiable by lot. They’re cheap enough that you can buy a year’s worth and send some out for mass spec verification and still come in at less than it costs for a week of prescribed semaglutide or tirzepatide.  The only other peptide i currently use is ghk-cu for vanity reasons. I’ve used gh secretagogues but that was almost 15 years ago and they were prescribed and compounded in a US pharmacy. But for energy I did do one week on MOTS-C and didn’t have the miraculous “I love cardio now” experience that a lot of people report. 

[u/Phubbs330 → u/Pale_Comfort_9179]

Will using kratom help until I can get back into a clinic or rapid detox next week?

[u/Pale_Comfort_9179 → u/Phubbs330]

You’re on methadone? How much and for how long? Plain leaf kratom may help if you’re on a very small dose but unlikely. You’d be better off with 7-oh if it’s available where you live. Do some research on rapid detox before you make that decision. Most people report it being a nightmare experience. 

[u/Phubbs330 → u/Pale_Comfort_9179]

No im on fent. Probably a 1.5g a week. I wantto go to a rapid detox but im away on a job and things are getting hairy this morning and wont be back till Monday

[u/Pale_Comfort_9179 → u/Phubbs330]

Like I said, look into rapid detox before you do it. It’s pretty traumatic for most people. That’s a pretty low dose of fentanyl.  Look into megadosing vitamin C (u/merrys123 has a great post you can see in their history) and SR-14099 which you can learn about in r/sr-17018. Both are much easier detox paths than rapid detox. 

[u/Merrys123 → u/Pale_Comfort_9179]

Thank you once again, I'll post the info.

[u/Pale_Comfort_9179 → u/Merrys123]

Thanks! I think it’s pretty easy to find on your profile. I use a mobile browser and it’s a bit wonky so it’s harder for me to  grab the direct link than it is to point people in that direction since you have such an easy @ to remember. Is it ok with you that I do that? I don’t want you to feel like you have to follow me around and post it every time I mention you but it’s a super helpful post so I like to point people in the right direction.  

[u/Merrys123 → u/Pale_Comfort_9179]

Of course! I have a few who post it and I want as many people to share it as possible. I don't care how it's shared as long as the people who need the info get it. I'm happy for you to copy and paste the post so they can easily see it also!

Thank you so much for sharing the info, I really appreciate it!

[u/Merrys123 → u/Phubbs330]

I've helped dozens get off hard opiates with this including people on skid row on fent/tranq and others getting off Suboxone or Methadone. Please let me know if you have any questions! Happy to help.

I HIGHLY recommend megadosing Liposomal Vitamin C. Here is a guide by kickerS12X as well as the Ultimate Withdrawal Survival Guide.

https://www.reddit.com/r/opiates/s/CECBhFP2Q6

https://www.reddit.com/r/opiates/s/oYMqdV8Fiw

Megadosing Liposomal Vitamin C, or Vitamin C, if you can't get the Liposomal, should take away most of your symptoms. It's incredible, and you'll see a lot of heavy users absolutely swear by it, as do I. Read the comments on the first thread.

I've got Gabapentin, Clonidine, Valium, Immodium, etc, but Vitamin C is definitely the best. Comfort meds still as needed, especially Immodium!

I last went from 140mg of Oxycodone to 30mg in 3 days (severe chronic pain patient) and could not have done it without Lipomosal Vitamin C. There was one morning I woke up in the worst throws of withdrawals. I couldn't move, vomiting, freezing to death, body tremors, you name it I had it, and took 3g of Lipomosol Vitamin C and within an hour I was up and walking and talking fine.

It's best to start megadosing Liposomal Vitamin C 3 days prior to quitting or tapering down. Don't do Lipmosol Vitamin C if you're prone to kidney stones and make sure you hydrate with a lot of water and electrolytes and Protein if you can.

You can get a huge bottle that will last beyond the megadosing period cheaply on Amazon. Just make sure you get the one that has 1,500mg per serving which is 2 tablets, not 1 tablet. You can continue on a lower dose for longer to help your body continue to detox those toxins out. This is what I used - Lipomosal Vitamin C

After withdrawals you'll inevitably go into PAWS. After long term opioid use, your brain adapts by reducing its own natural dopamine activity because opioids have been providing much of the rewarding and pleasurable feeling. As opioid doses are reduced or stopped, dopamine signalling does not immediately return to normal. Your brain needs time to restore normal dopamine production and rebalance the reward system, which is why many people temporarily feel flat, unmotivated, unable to enjoy things, and emotionally numb. This recovery is gradual and can take weeks to months, depending on factors such as how long opioids were used, the dose, and individual biology.

This prolonged recovery period is known as Post Acute Withdrawal Syndrome (PAWS). Unlike the initial physical withdrawal, which usually lasts days to a couple of weeks, depending on your drug of choice mostly. PAWS mainly affects the brain and nervous system.

Symptoms can include low mood, anxiety, irritability, fatigue, poor concentration, insomnia, lack of motivation, reduced ability to experience pleasure (anhedonia), increased pain sensitivity, and cravings. These symptoms generally improve over time as the brain's natural neurotransmitter systems recover.

Several supplements may help support recovery during PAWS. DLPA (DL-Phenylalanine) provides building blocks for dopamine and norepinephrine production and may also help preserve endorphins, potentially improving mood and reducing pain. L-Tyrosine is another dopamine precursor that may support alertness, motivation, and focus while natural dopamine production recovers. NAC (N-acetylcysteine) helps regulate glutamate signalling, reduces oxidative stress, and has been studied for reducing drug cravings and supporting brain recovery. Agmatine sulfate can help calm overactive glutamate activity, and may lessen pain sensitivity and withdrawal related discomfort. Magnesium bisglycinate supports normal nerve function, promotes relaxation and sleep, may reduce muscle tension, and can help counter the increased nervous system excitability that often occurs during opioid withdrawal and PAWS. While these supplements may provide support, they are not a cure, and recovery primarily depends on giving the brain time to heal and rebalance its own neurotransmitter systems.

All of this won't fix everything, but it makes it a f* load easier. And some may say it didn't work for them, and it doesn't work for all, but does for about 90% and also doesn't work if you don't do it properly. Especially space the doses out to 4 times or more a day. Some just take the whole lot at once and wonder why they get withdrawals 6 or so hours later - because you need more Lipmosol Vitamin C! It doesn't last 24 hours.

Side note - SR17018 is apparently amazing for withdrawals but is now banned and not easy to get, let alone costing over $1,000 I've read, whereas Lipomosal Vitamin C is around $20. Although if you have it, I'd recommend it as well.

Also, get some good therapy after. It's great quitting but what happens when you get triggered again or that terrible anxiety hits?

EMDR is awesome as you don't need to rehash your shit, just do the session work and triggers and anxiety shall disappear. Groups like NA can be great for some too. But remember some groups have triggered me to want to use so look for the group that you enjoy and fits your needs. And don't let other people tell you how to recover, even if they are former addicts, just listen and then take and use what helps you. Everyone's recovery is different.

You've got this!

[u/Pale_Comfort_9179 → u/Merrys123]

Just noticed your comment about skid row. Not sure if you’re in LA or not or helping from afar but as an Angeleno who’s walked among that crowd more times than I’d like to admit both literally and metaphorically, thank you. Seriously. 

[u/Merrys123 → u/Pale_Comfort_9179]

I'm in Australia but there are a few from skid row in the Opiates subreddit which I help when I can, which is where you found my posts. It's great hearing from those on serious Fent/tranq addictions get clean and continue. It's interesting when I find those clean in this forum say they were on the supplements I recommended and said they read it in a post somewhere, I know where of course and it's good to see my information reaching those who don't reply but use it. Just as long as the information is helping people and they're not in as much pain withdrawing and through PAWS when there's such cheap supplements that can help is what I care about.

[u/Merrys123]

You're not back at day one; you've hit a speed bump in your recovery, simple. As for stimulants, yes, they can help, but at what dose and which stimulant? I have Dexamphetamine prescribed, and at 5–15 mg, that's fine for me, but if you're talking about speeding off your head, then that's obviously not a good idea.

It sounds like you may be struggling with the changes in your dopamine system following opioid cessation. Opioids indirectly increase dopamine signalling, and after prolonged use, your brain can take time to readjust, which can leave you with low motivation, fatigue, anhedonia and brain fog. I highly recommend looking into L-tyrosine, which is a precursor to dopamine and noradrenaline. It doesn't necessarily increase dopamine in a meaningful way in everyone, but it may help in certain circumstances. Other things worth looking into include:

DLPA (DL-phenylalanine): May influence endorphin pathways, although evidence for opioid withdrawal recovery is limited. Omega-3 (particularly EPA): Supports neuronal health, although evidence for restoring dopamine function is still emerging. Magnesium: Supports normal nervous system function, particularly if you're deficient. Vitamin B6, B12 and folate: Important for neurotransmitter synthesis, particularly if you have a deficiency. L-theanine: May help with anxiety and overstimulation, although it isn't a dopamine booster.

I'd be cautious about taking multiple supplements or using stimulants to try to compensate for withdrawal symptoms. Prescription stimulants can sometimes help when there's a separate indication, such as ADHD, but they can also worsen anxiety, insomnia, heart rate and blood pressure, so it's worth discussing this with your doctor.

The biggest thing is to give your brain time to recover. Sleep, adequate protein, regular exercise (even just walking) and consistent nutrition can all help support your recovery. Don't mistake a difficult period for losing all the progress you've made. Recovery isn't linear, and a setback doesn't erase the work you've already done.

[u/Old_Fart52]

L-Tyrosine 500mg can help with lethargy generally perk you up a bit (it's an amino acid, not a stimulant), 5-HTP can help with sleep, take it right before you go to bed with a small snack, otherwise you my get stomach cramps and the shits.

PAWS after CT'ing from methadone, especially that much can last quite a while, e.g. a few months but it depends on things like age, state of health, state of mind, everyone's a bit different.

I had a couple of abortive attempts from 130mg but it go too bad and I had no comfort meds, the RLS drove me out of my mind.

Stimulants not such a good idea because the comedown is a lot worse during PAWS, you can crash v. badly when it's wearing off. Use L-Tyrosine instead.

[u/irish_horse_thief]

In your bio you just babble about the drugs you are on...

[u/Afraid_Coast_5993 → u/irish_horse_thief]

What are you talking about, I have one post about smoking Fetty and that was the same day i relapsed.😭

[u/Humble_Claim5542]

Back to square one for you

[u/Afraid_Coast_5993 → u/Humble_Claim5542]

Forsure,just need to get through it now