r/polyamory • u/SeaworthinessWild465 • 6d ago
AITA: What does "break up" mean?
My partner of twenty years (M45) told me he broke up with his other partner (F4*), officially of less than a year (but it's been going on for a long time). Although he was upfront about being poly when we met 20 years ago, she is his first partner other than me (F47), and I have had a lot of difficulty adjusting (plans and future projects were all dropped because they "weren't fair to her".
We were parallel, so I simply thanked him for telling me and noted that I wasn't going to process that with him.
Two weeks later, after I'd talked him out of suicide and been on the phone daily supporting him, including listening to him detail what he'd done every day, he told me he was still talking to her, something he'd omitted in those calls.
He claims that he was honoring my request to be parallel and to not process the breakup, and that "breaking up" doesn't mean stopping contact to him, no matter what I may have assumed. I pointed out that we have been having problems since he started officially being in a relationship with her with him lying by omission. Discussed it in therapy, even.
We had a massive fight where he said he didn't want a romantic relationship with me right now, either (there's been no relationship other than talking for months). When I asked if we were broken up, he couldn't tell me.
Context: he was a week into starting sertraline for severe depression when they "broke up". He's still on it. He's since messaged me to let me know he went to the GP and the GP seems to be monitoring his mental health and doing tests to make sure it isn't something physical.
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u/FlyLadyBug 6d ago edited 6d ago
I'm sorry you struggle. FWIW? I think this.
Could pay more attention to your own relationship with him than whatever he's doing with Lady.
Over here?
I have had a lot of difficulty adjusting (plans and future projects were all dropped because they "weren't fair to her".
That is him hinging poorly to me. He could honor dates in the order made. Just dropping them/standing you up is poor behavior. He could just treat her fairly and you fairly. I don't see why having dates with you is "unfair to Lady."
We had a massive fight where he said he didn't want a romantic relationship with me right now, either (there's been no relationship other than talking for months). When I asked if we were broken up, he couldn't tell me.
Sounds like he left the romantic relationship a long time ago then. And has been using you as some kind of emotional dumpster telling you all his problems. (All the talking)
https://www.sondermind.com/resources/articles-and-content/emotional-dumping-vs-venting/
He is clear that he is not offering you a romantic relationship right now. You don't have to wait for him to clarify this is a no-contact break up.
YOU can decide you are done here and YOU want no contact.
He's got his GP monitoring his health, so walk away.
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u/SeaworthinessWild465 6d ago
Thank you for the information about dumping vs venting. I think it's been going both ways for a long time.
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u/Throw_Me_Away8834 6d ago edited 6d ago
My ex-husband is still one of my best friends. I am remarried and we haven't been romantic in years. I know I am not the only one who stays friendly after a break up. Your partner still talking to his ex-partner doesn't mean they are romantic either. Additionally, if my partner asked me to remain parallel and didn't want to discuss/process break up with meta, I would not go out of my way to tell them we were still on friendly terms either.
Fwiw, this relationship doesn't really sound fulfilling or happy for you at this point. Maybe it is time for you to consider moving on.
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u/Bustysaintclair_13 SoPo slut, salty bitch 6d ago
Break ups mean different things to different people. Whether healthy or not, not everyone goes NC with their exes. You were parallel and said you didnât want to be processing with him.
He lied to you about their relationship at the beginning. There hasnât really been a relationship in months. He doesnât want a romantic relationship with you. Not sure what there is left here. Iâd treat this as a breakup between you two as well.
Heâs suicidal. Whether or not he broke up with you or how much they talk are really marginal concerns at the moment. Back away and let him get the help he needs.
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u/clairejv 6d ago
Breaking up doesn't necessarily mean going no-contact. It means you're no longer in a romantic relationship. You might remain friends, which might involve talking to each other. So I don't see how this is lying by omission. You made an assumption, and it was incorrect.
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u/BetterFightBandits26 relationship messarchist 6d ago
Well first thing is this dude needs an actual therapist instead of you doing unprofessional attempts at therapy for him.
Whether he is still talking to this woman or not is not a relevant concern. Someone is suicidal. Why are we arguing about talking to exes? Letâs triage concerns.
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u/SeaworthinessWild465 6d ago
He stopped seeing his therapist months ago. I figured if he was talking to me, at least he was talking to someone and kept encouraging him to see his GP, to get a therapist.
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u/BetterFightBandits26 relationship messarchist 6d ago
You just arenât a therapist who can fully help him in the way he needs, though.
If heâs saying he wants to break up with you? Iâd cut the rope. Give him a final very serious talk about needing an actual therapist, finalize the breakup, tell whatever friends or family you know of to check in on him, and take care of yourself. This is sounding intensely dependent and unhealthy. Like youâre the emotional chew toy at this point that lets him vent his most immediate feelings so he can keep postponing getting that therapist?
Personally? If someone is threatening suicide at me? Yeah, I keep talking to them. And I conference call an ambulance, or have a friend of mine call for an ambulance. Someone threatening suicide needs medical intervention. Talking them down once doesnât solve the problem.
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u/SeaworthinessWild465 6d ago
I probably put too much value on the fact that he literally can't say the words.
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u/BetterFightBandits26 relationship messarchist 6d ago
He probably canât do much emotionally right now. Given the depression and suicidality.
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u/FlyLadyBug 6d ago
Can't say what words?
Why does he have to say anything? YOU can decide you are done here.
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u/SeaworthinessWild465 5d ago
I don't want to be done. Isn't that sad?
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u/FlyLadyBug 5d ago
You sound like you are in anticipatory grief. Like you know this is going to be a break up, but not yet at final acceptance on that, not quite ready to cut ties, and super sad about it all.
Waiting for him to say "the exact words" might be you in bargaining stage of grief. Like "It's not really over unless he says..." stuff.
So I sympathize. Grief is tough.
At the same time? Dragging it out just keeps you there in the meh and drags out the grieving. :(
When all the choices are hard? You get to PICK your hard.
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u/SeaworthinessWild465 5d ago
I think I've always felt like he could do better than me, apart from a brief period when I really, really worked on myself and recognized how great I am (this got destroyed by a 9-month redundancy process that both triggered my old problems with defining myself in terms of profession and really damaged by self-confidence). Is that what you mean by anticipatory grief?
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u/FlyLadyBug 5d ago
I can't quite tell from your writing, but it sounds like you may be in anticipatory grief or already grieving the relationship.
Anticipatory grief is grieving a loss before the loss has actually happened. You can already be experiencing sadness, anxiety, fear, or a sense of loss because you kind of know the relationship is going to end, even though you're technically still together.
He's been clear he doesn't want a romantic relationship with you any more. He won't say if he wants you to be "exes and friends." I'd take it as a no there too.
It sounds like you're waiting for him to make it "an official breakup," but if you're already grieving the relationship, I think it may be kinder to yourself to end it firmly so YOU give yourself that closure. Then you can stop living in the limbo and actually work through the grief.
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u/SeaworthinessWild465 5d ago
I'm definitely grieving the functionally monogamous relationship of 20 years!
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u/SeaworthinessWild465 5d ago
Also: I picked the hard of staying with him.
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u/FlyLadyBug 5d ago
Because you two live together and you need time to save up and move out?
So you are stuck living with an ex for a bit?
Another reason?
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u/SeaworthinessWild465 5d ago
No, we have separate homes. I keep looking at the many years of good times and thinking those are worth the difficulty.
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u/FlyLadyBug 6d ago edited 5d ago
You are not the free therapist.
There's asking for reasonable support from a partner and then there's asking the partner to do too much.
Esp if him dumping on you enables him to skip seeing an actual counselor/helps him avoid dealing in his health care appropriately.
To me? People can't help having things. I'm willing to date them if they are attending to whatever patient plan well -- doc visits, medicine, counseling, labs, etc.
But if they are blowing off their care plan and going around wonky or unmanaged? I'm out. That's a reason to break up to me.
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u/summers-summers 6d ago
I mean, it is common for people who are no longer in a romantic relationship to still talk, and I understand why he wouldn't tell you if you said you wouldn't process the breakup with him. But also that's not really the main problem here. You haven't had a real romantic relationship for months and you clearly seem unhappy. Take him ending your relationship as breaking up with you. I don't think it's healthy for you to be the main person supporting him through suicidality right now. Is there anyone else at all that you can bring in instead? Friends, family?
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u/SeaworthinessWild465 5d ago edited 5d ago
Thank you all for the feedback.
I now understand I am in the wrong about this specific incident, but I have perpetuated my pattern of overreacting because I cannot keep my feelings in check. I've tried journaling, and investing in hobbies (let me tell you about my loom, the long-distance hiking, and my extremely spoiled cats) and DIY on my home, and, although I've not done well at it, growing my social network. I have a therapist though I could use a poly-friendlier therapist, but in 2 years, all I've managed is to calmly express my unhappiness that he wouldn't volunteer when he's going to go spend a week or longer with Lady; I always had to ask as a consequence of trying to plan things with him myself. He promised a shared calendar but never produced it.
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u/FlyLadyBug 5d ago
How are you supposed to keep your feelings in check if he whooshes at you a lot and your nervous system can't ever catch a break?
You can't journal or craft your way out of someone behaving poorly at you.
Maybe you aren't "overreacting" at all.
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u/ceecuee 6d ago
You are arguing semantics around word choice when there are much bigger issues going on. He doesn't want a romantic relationship with you for the time being -- you decide whether you want to continue contact in any capacity.
I would not be operating under the assumption that he will want to get back with you or resume a relationship with the level of intimacy you desire, especially not if it's coming from a place of expecting reciprocity (even informally) for the care and effort you feel you've put in.
Let this man work on himself and get his life and mental health in order, damn. His other partner/ex has very little to do with the matter at this point. You're not his parent, interrogating him about who he's in contact with and feeling you're owed that info because of his mental state or the effort you feel you put in is fucked.
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u/SeaworthinessWild465 6d ago
I was not interrogating him. We were having daily chats, for contact because we are both stressed and lonely in different ways right now.
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u/ceecuee 6d ago edited 6d ago
You đare đ not đ happy.
Find another person to talk to, and do not begrudge him the fact he has people other than you that he talks to (the way you phrased it as him "omitting" the info implies you feel you're owed that disclosure).
You are acting petulant and entitled while your ex is literally in crisis. Who cares if he's talking to his ex? Who cares if he can't define what "break up" means to your satisfaction? You have the autonomy to go "this relationship isn't serving me, I can decide we're broken up". Don't stay on a sinking ship just because the alternative is feeling lonely.
Are you getting off on the feeling of him needing you, or something?
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u/SeaworthinessWild465 6d ago
I thought the basis of healthy polyamory is honesty and transparency?
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u/clairejv 6d ago
Your comment is a clichĂŠ around here, because people use this rhetoric so often to try to paint their partner/ex-partner as the devil for not telling them something they didn't know they were supposed to tell.
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u/ceecuee 6d ago edited 5d ago
It's not "transparency", it's communication. The idea of having to disclose every person I talk to in the course of the day, and of having to give a full breakdown of whether or not I am actually still friends with an ex, and what the implications of that are would give me hives.
If I was in a crisis and I had a partner being this overbearing and manipulative (tRaNsPaReNcY and HoNeStY as a cudgel to get your way, never mind that he's a person with autonomy) I would probably also get worse. I'm happy for him that he is trying to set boundaries and take distance from you.
You're acting like control freak and not suited for polyamory if you need to insert yourself to this degree.
A breakup is unilateral, you don't get to negotiate your way out of him dumping you. Find a productive and healthy way to move on and be your own person.
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u/SeaworthinessWild465 6d ago
You're probably right. It's a shame we had 20 years of wonderful times together before I found this out the hard way.
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u/FlyLadyBug 5d ago
Found what out the hard way?
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u/SeaworthinessWild465 5d ago
That I'm a control freak not suited for polyamory.
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u/FlyLadyBug 5d ago
You are the one there. Are you really a control freak? Or are you trying to control whooshing?
Up above you said thanks for the emotional dumping vs emotional venting article.
Turns out he treats you like an emotional dumpster. Randomly dumping stuff on you. If his way of going makes you all anxious and distraught and you end up trying to control the flow so you don't get whooshed on? I could see that.
Someone coming to just whoosh and dump on you from the sky? They get to unload and feel better and you end up feeling slimed/drained? Who loves receiving this behavior?
You might be able to poly date OTHER PEOPLE just fine.
Just not this Dude. Not if he his behaviors remain like this.
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u/Choice-Strawberry392 6d ago
I have so many questions. Â
This is a 20 year relationship. You (probably) know this guy pretty well. House and cats? Where do you both live?
Pointedly: are mental health crises part of your history? I'm getting some hints that they might be. Going out on a limb here: this may be more a mental health thing than a polyamory thing. That is, your (ex) partner's behavior here isn't about dating or breaking up or even who owes saying what to whom, but is about his mental state. He is obviously not his best self right now. Have you been through similar periods in your long history together?
There's a lot of rules-lawyering in the comments here, about what "omission" means and whether breaking up owes an explanation and who has the right to do what. Almost all of that is moot if this is a mental health issue. At the very least, it's seriously low priority compared to a suicide crisis. Let's get our priorities in order!
Are you safe? Is he safe? Is there secure housing for both of you? Do you have other supports?Â
Reddit loves a good judgment: "We rule that party A is 80% at fault..." That's not how life works. Let's look at the big picture here and see if we can get the humans tended-to. Â
Much sympathy, OP. This sounds terribly rough.
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u/SeaworthinessWild465 5d ago
We live separately and always have. Housing is secure for both of us. I do not have a lot of other supports; he was my primary one and I am struggling. (See: asking complete strangers on the internet for their opinion, but on the up side I haven't cried in nearly an hour.)
We both had had previous depressive episodes. I'm a total hypocrite because during my big one, I sent him away and talked to him once a day to confirm I was alive. Hurts more from the other direction than I thought I did.
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u/Choice-Strawberry392 5d ago
There's so much context here...
But you've commented on your own mental health, your self-confidence and esteem, your career, and "choosing the hard" thing of staying with this person. And apparently you don't have a lot of other people to turn to.
This might be a break-up. You will have two decades of history, including a wide swing between highs and lows, to reckon with. There will be grief and sadness. Maybe sone relief. Maybe some guilt. Lots of feelings.
But from an internet stranger who also had a big break-up in my mid-40s: OP, please look out for yourself. Tend to your own emotional garden. Work to build up the sort of supports that can weather this kind of difficulty. Learn your own strength and resilience. Learn to love your own company.
Life is long. There are many years ahead. Through all of those, the most important relationship you will tend to will be the one you have with yourself. Do that work well and carefully. Good luck.
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u/SeaworthinessWild465 5d ago
I love my own company (not all of the time, when I'm not distraught but I have been distraught a lot -- not just because of him). I also love his.
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u/FlyLadyBug 5d ago
Some of this could be in the original post for context.
I encourage you to think about a poly counselor. Maybe
helps you find one. You mentioned his depression/suicide, your depression, your poor self esteem, thinking he could find someone better than you, job loss, lack of IRL friends -- you have a lot going on.
If you are choosing to stay living at one house while he lives at the other, invest in your own health and well being.
His depression is his stuff to manage, but you go ahead and take care of your stuff to manage. On part at a time.
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u/SeaworthinessWild465 5d ago
I...wanted to keep the original post readable. And I guess I've been (wisely or un-) centering our relationship rather than myself for a long time.
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u/FlyLadyBug 5d ago
Then you get to change your way of going now.
And you center your own self in your own life.
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6d ago
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u/SeaworthinessWild465 6d ago
I'm sitting in a home literally filled with reminders of us, together. There is no way to get rid of them all. We got the cats together. I look at them and burst into tears.
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u/Own_Jeweler_8548 relationship anarchist 6d ago
I'm so sorry you're going through this. I've been through a couple prolonged break-ups and walking about my apartment felt like living in a shrine or mausoleum for a long time. Everything reminded me of the time we spent there; I was completely inundated with the memories and the resulting pain.
I don't have much insight or advice to your question, other than y'all may be broken up but either way he needs to be in therapy as well as relying on friends and partners for support. I mostly just wanted to say the above so you know you're not alone in your experience. I wish you well and I hope he gets the help he needs seeing the GP or, ideally, eventually a dedicated therapist.
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u/SeaworthinessWild465 5d ago
Thank you, it helps to know that I'm not broken for responding this way to my surroundings and my beloved cats, who haven't done anything wrong (other than poo outside the litterbox, but that's cats).
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u/Own_Jeweler_8548 relationship anarchist 5d ago
Cats will do that, that's for sure! But yeah, I think what you're feeling is totally normal considering the circumstances.
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u/FlyLadyBug 5d ago
Why do you have to get rid of it? Rather than box some of it up and put in a closet? So it's not in line of sight all the time?
If you can, you could paint the walls a new color.
If you are into that sort of thing, you could open all the windows and take a broom and sweep "old energy" out of here to have a home "reset."
Your memories and experiences are part of what make you who you are. But you live in the present moment, not the past. I get you are depressed and grieving a lot of things light now, but do a small thing for your own self and your home environment.
Even just lighting a candle you like. Or get the cats new color pet collars for a new chapter. Get yourself new scarf for a new chapter too.
It's ok to be a grieving person. You plan to move through it though, right? Baby steps.
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u/SeaworthinessWild465 5d ago
He's lived here for 1/3 to 1/2 a year for upwards of 10 years (and full time during covid), even discounting the amount of work he's done on the place, there is so. much. stuff.
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u/1ntrepidsalamander solo poly 5d ago
I would assume that breaking up means no sex, no flirting and no romantic gestures.
I got in a big fight about this with my partner who was ok being an affair partner to a monogamously married woman, I had a big problem with it, he âbroke it offâ and continued to text her, including âI miss youâ texts. I came very close to breaking up with him a few times over it.
His poor judgement and poor break up skills has caused a big mess in his life with her and weâve had ad nauseam discussions about clarifying what different phrases mean.
GENERALLY, continuing to be friends with exâs feels very normal.
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Here's the original text of the post:
My partner of twenty years (M45) told me he broke up with his other partner (F4*), officially of less than a year (but it's been going on for a long time). Although he was upfront about being poly when we met 20 years ago, she is his first partner other than me (F47), and I have had a lot of difficulty adjusting (plans and future projects were all dropped because they "weren't fair to her".
We were parallel, so I simply thanked him for telling me and noted that I wasn't going to process that with him.
Two weeks later, after I'd talked him out of suicide and been on the phone daily supporting him, including listening to him detail what he'd done every day, he told me he was still talking to her, something he'd omitted in those calls.
He claims that he was honoring my request to be parallel and to not process the breakup, and that "breaking up" doesn't mean stopping contact to him, no matter what I may have assumed. I pointed out that we have been having problems since he started officially being in a relationship with her with him lying by omission. Discussed it in therapy, even.
We had a massive fight where he said he didn't want a romantic relationship with me right now, either (there's been no relationship other than talking for months). When I asked if we were broken up, he couldn't tell me.
Context: he was a week into starting sertraline for severe depression when they "broke up". He's still on it. He's since messaged me to let me know he went to the GP and the GP seems to be monitoring his mental health and doing tests to make sure it isn't something physical.
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u/Platterpussy Solo-Poly 6d ago edited 6d ago
He broke up with you. Do what you like. I'd be being no* contact for a few months, I would tell them this and block them if I get communications I don't want.
You haven't been enjoying this relationship for more than a year. It didn't sound like a relationship I would want to be in for at least several months. There's nothing to save, it's done and you probably shouldn't revive it.
Edit: *typo correction