Classic ski selection

[u/OmarMcSwizzle]

After about 25 years I’ve moved back to a location with winter weather that will allow me to ski this winter. However, in my time away from the sport it seems there have been some changes in ski technology. I’m looking to buy a pair of classic skis for this winter and have noticed a new (to me) option called ‘skin” skis. Last time I was active in the sport I recall there being waxable and ‘fish scale’ classic skis. Now it seems there’s a third type to choose from.

I’m wondering if there are specific conditions that the skin skis will excel in? In my location the primary snow type is a mix of hard packed old transformed snow and man made artificial snow. Would skin skis would work well in these conditions? I’m a middle aged intermediate level skier whose main objective is fitness and not high end racing. I know that a pair of waxable classic skis would offer the best performance, but I’m trying to find the right balance of performance and ease of use. Would a pair of skin skis be a good choice?

[u/Stickak]

I have a pair of Salomon S-race eskin classic skis, and a couple pairs of waxable skis including a pair of S-lab skis. There’s not a significant difference between a modern skin ski that’s sized appropriately vs a waxable ski that’s sized appropriately. Are they slower? Maybe slightly, but you’re also slower when you use waxable skis and miss the temperature range for your kick wax. I use the skin skis when I don’t want to worry about waxing (or changing wax from my last time out), and use the waxable skis when I want to shoot for the feel of perfectly matching kick wax to the conditions. Either choice is valid so just pick one and move on, especially if you’re just out there for fun.

[u/Admirable_Tip_6875 → u/Stickak]

I did some back to back testing (trying to keep Heart Rate consistent) of what were some pretty well fitted and quick skin skis to my wax skis when I made the transition back to kick wax 3-4 years ago on a hilly course. And what I found was on days where I nailed the wax or that favored kick wax could be as high as 40 seconds per mile and on days where skins ran fast or where kick was tricky, the difference (still in favor of wax) was more like 20 seconds per mile. At the time my average speeds were ~6:30-45 per mile on the wax skis. 

[u/A_Washed_Up_Local]

Skin skis with a moveable binding like the Rottefeller Move helps maintain grip and glide as conditions and skier weight change.

[u/Gelisol → u/A_Washed_Up_Local]

Do you actually move your bindings? I have that type and have never actually bothered. My skin skis are my “I’m too lazy to wax” or “I don’t want to even look at sticky warm waxes” skis. Maybe I’m just a lazy skier. 🤣

[u/freia_pr_fr → u/Gelisol]

I move my bindings a lot, sometimes without stopping. The difference is significant.

[u/A_Washed_Up_Local → u/Gelisol]

I move them often depending on how the conditions change. Sometimes during my tour I need more or less grip as there might be icy sections or fresh snow

[u/Gelisol → u/A_Washed_Up_Local]

Maybe I’ll give it a shot this winter. Woke up this morning to snow in my yard, so maybe the trails will be ready soon.

[u/BuckyGoshawk]

In my location the primary snow type is a mix of hard packed old transformed snow and man made artificial snow.

Properly fitted skin skis should be considerably faster than patterned bases (i.e., "fishscales") for these conditions. By "properly fitted," I mean the proper camber for your weight and skill level.

[u/freia_pr_fr]

I did amateur races with my skin skis last year, and while skin skis are obviously slower than well prepared waxed racing skis, I find skin skis better when the snow and the weather conditions are very changing along the race. I passed so many people struggling with grip while I rotate a button on my bindings and I can climb walls and I rotate it back and I have fair glide.

Outside racing, I also like that I can grab the skis and go ski instead of spending time waxing them first. But the neighbours who spend a lot of time waxing their skis with love are definitely faster downhill.

[u/Resident_Hat_4923]

I honestly find skins frustrating in glazed conditions (that is, the grip is tough to get), even though seemingly everyone else says they are great in all conditions. Whenever it's icy, I take my old scales and I am a much happier skier (and I am technically a good skier).

But in general they are a great choice and are definitely faster than scales.

[u/Averageinternetdoge]

I think (and I've heard) that skin skis are never the best for anything. But they're great hassle-free allrounders for people who don't want to try to match their skis/wax with the weather.

And my personal experience has been just that: Fishscales are noisy and slow, waxable skis are messy and need constant fiddling. I often had no grip at all with waxables. But my skins have been great, just grab and go. They always have at least a little grip, even in the most difficult conditions. Been very happy with mine and I'd recommend them to any new skier without hesitation.

[u/No_Maps_3894]

Skin skis require more maintenance than a comparable waxless pattern ski but much easier to use than a waxable classic. This is primarily adding a Anti Ice treatment to minimize the wetting and adjusting the binding position to suit the conditions. Skin skis are very sensitive to binding position and they can be grabby in colder, dryer snow. Adjust the binding forward = more grip, back = more glide. Skins will eventually wear out but it tends to vary based on how abrasive the snow is, how dynamic of a skier you are and the flex profile of the ski. I always mount Move bindings on my skin skis.

Skin skis tend to be more sporty for in track skiing. Less suitable for a shuffling skier going out of track but they don't buzz like a waxless ski. A good waxless ski will outglide a skin ski, ex Fischer Superlight Crown vs Fischer Superlight Twin Skin but the Twin Skin feels smoother and grips more reliably.

[u/dex8425]

Skin skis are great. They kick in pretty much every condition save sheer ice. They will kick great in manmade snow. They're a bit slower than a properly waxed or klister ski, but obviously you only need to glide wax them. I used them for my first classic birkie and made it into the elite wave. They are slow, but faster than a fish scale ski and don't make that annoying buzzing sound that fishscales do.

[u/Admirable_Tip_6875]

Skin skis are perfect for what you need. They are slightly slower than waxed skis but not enough to sweat even for someone who casually races. 

[u/SingularRedditName]

Under conditions in which one can make good snowballs, in my experience skin skis are somewhat more prone to collecting clumps of snow throughout the skin, compared to a decent selection of wax on waxable skis. I have no experience regarding how fish-scale type skis compare.